Full marks to Ullrich

[Warren]

In article <[email protected]>, Precious Pup <[email protected]> wrote:

> warren wrote:
> >
> > In article <[email protected]>, Bob Schwartz <[email protected]> wrote:
> >
> > > The point of my post was that riders do what their DS tells them to do if they want to keep
> > > their jobs. And no DS is going to tell a rider that it is OK to reward someone who is a poor
> > > sprinter. And no DS is going to hand a gift to someone just out of the goodness of their
> > > hearts. You might do that as a favor that you might expect to call in later. But certainly not
> > > for any stupid reason like the other guy did all the work.
> >
> > It's a little slap in the face that isn't forgotten.
>
> It depends. If someone wants to pull someone else to the line, whose fault is that? I mean, the
> whole idea of killing a break (for *your* team's tactical reasons) is to sit someone on it till
> the "workers" finally decide it tactically doesn't make sense for them and their teams because
> they will get beaten in the end. To put some sort of "that isn't nice to beat me like that"
> defeats the essence of the "sit on it to kill it" tactic.

But that was not the tactic wanted by the riders sitting on. They needed to gain time on the guys
behind themselves. They sat on Ullrich and let/made him do all the pacemeaking and breaking the wind
(what little there was) and then instead of going to the front to help gain more time on their
rivals they just tried to beat the guy who been helping them, and it wasn't even for the win. I've
heard and seen several comments attributed to riders in the race who also think what the Euskatel
guys did wasn't the best choice.

-WG

 

[Precious Pup]

warren wrote:
>
> In article <[email protected]>, Precious Pup <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > warren wrote:
> > >
> > > In article <[email protected]>, Bob Schwartz <[email protected]> wrote:
> > >
> > > > The point of my post was that riders do what their DS tells them to do if they want to keep
> > > > their jobs. And no DS is going to tell a rider that it is OK to reward someone who is a poor
> > > > sprinter. And no DS is going to hand a gift to someone just out of the goodness of their
> > > > hearts. You might do that as a favor that you might expect to call in later. But certainly
> > > > not for any stupid reason like the other guy did all the work.
> > >
> > > It's a little slap in the face that isn't forgotten.
> >
> > It depends. If someone wants to pull someone else to the line, whose fault is that? I mean, the
> > whole idea of killing a break (for *your* team's tactical reasons) is to sit someone on it till
> > the "workers" finally decide it tactically doesn't make sense for them and their teams because
> > they will get beaten in the end. To put some sort of "that isn't nice to beat me like that"
> > defeats the essence of the "sit on it to kill it" tactic.
>
> But that was not the tactic wanted by the riders sitting on. They needed to gain time on the guys
> behind themselves. They sat on Ullrich and let/made him do all the pacemeaking and breaking the
> wind (what little there was) and then instead of going to the front to help gain more time on
> their rivals they just tried to beat the guy who been helping them, and it wasn't even for the
> win. I've heard and seen several comments attributed to riders in the race who also think what the
> Euskatel guys did wasn't the best choice.

We'll see if the 4 s matters in the end. If Mayo has 1 s over Tyler after it is over (or even if it
is close on way or the other), then maybe Mayonnaise "did the right thing." Personally I doubt it
won him any friends, but people do "wrong stuff" at the spur of the moment all the time. Even
professionals.

 

[Warren]

In article <[email protected]>, Precious Pup <[email protected]> wrote:

> warren wrote:
> >
> > In article <[email protected]>, Precious Pup <[email protected]> wrote:
> >
> > > warren wrote:
> > > >
> > > > In article <[email protected]>, Bob Schwartz <[email protected]> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > The point of my post was that riders do what their DS tells them to do if they want to
> > > > > keep their jobs. And no DS is going to tell a rider that it is OK to reward someone who is
> > > > > a poor sprinter. And no DS is going to hand a gift to someone just out of the goodness of
> > > > > their hearts. You might do that as a favor that you might expect to call in later. But
> > > > > certainly not for any stupid reason like the other guy did all the work.
> > > >
> > > > It's a little slap in the face that isn't forgotten.
> > >
> > > It depends. If someone wants to pull someone else to the line, whose fault is that? I mean,
> > > the whole idea of killing a break (for *your* team's tactical reasons) is to sit someone on it
> > > till the "workers" finally decide it tactically doesn't make sense for them and their teams
> > > because they will get beaten in the end. To put some sort of "that isn't nice to beat me like
> > > that" defeats the essence of the "sit on it to kill it" tactic.
> >
> > But that was not the tactic wanted by the riders sitting on. They needed to gain time on the
> > guys behind themselves. They sat on Ullrich and let/made him do all the pacemeaking and breaking
> > the wind (what little there was) and then instead of going to the front to help gain more time
> > on their rivals they just tried to beat the guy who been helping them, and it wasn't even for
> > the win. I've heard and seen several comments attributed to riders in the race who also think
> > what the Euskatel guys did wasn't the best choice.
>
> We'll see if the 4 s matters in the end. If Mayo has 1 s over Tyler after it is over (or even if
> it is close on way or the other), then maybe Mayonnaise "did the right thing." Personally I doubt
> it won him any friends, but people do "wrong stuff" at the spur of the moment all the time. Even
> professionals.

As Phil once said, "Never underestimate the strength of a man when he sees the finish line."
Sprinters live this.

-WG