It's killing me but..........
- Thread starter Sillyoldtwit
- Start date
So I will be testing next week, it has been 5 weeks since I tested. I am dying to know what improvements I have made, I feel they have been significant. I am wondering if I can take anything from the following, while my legs are sore as all hell making PE difficult to gauge anything my HR at 90% is more consistent with my HR @ 83%. Also for my 5x5 intervals I target 380, my HR during these efforts is actually slightly below my HR when I do my 20 min test. My last test indicated my FTP is right around 340, maybe a touch more, I was at 350 last season (based off of multiple 1hr 350+NP, not testing). Typically my 20min indoors is close to my FTP outdoors.
Impressive numbers bgoetz, good luck with the testing next week.
I can't remember if it's a pithy power proverb from over on the wattage list, but it sure seems that when you think you're fitness has increased....it probably has.
Good luck,
-Dave
I can't remember if it's a pithy power proverb from over on the wattage list, but it sure seems that when you think you're fitness has increased....it probably has.
Good luck,
-Dave
Man the workout today made the legs feel like lead!! But it was a good one. I am noticing now that my L3 numbers are SST numbers in hour two and the last 30 minutes are L4. I could not finish the entire 3 hours but still happy.
I also had one of my "soggy socks" ride where the socks and shoes were soaked. Good stuff! The year is going ok. I am looking forward to outdoor rides soon.
I also had one of my "soggy socks" ride where the socks and shoes were soaked. Good stuff! The year is going ok. I am looking forward to outdoor rides soon.
I've said it before my legs ache just thinking about a 3 hour L3/SST indoor training session. /img/vbsmilies/smilies/smile.gif
I was thinking about your indoor training insanity (/img/vbsmilies/smilies/smile.gif) last night while starting to extend my L4 duration time. I am looking forward to getting up solid 60 minute L4's on back to back days indoor because I will be nearing another FTP adjustment. Currently I am nudging up the intensity on some days with going for 95%+ on the 20's, throwing in some over and unders at the end of the training and on other days staying toward 90% and extending the sustained time. CTL went flat this month because of working a lot of overtime and then bad weather on the weekends either did not ride outside or did something shorter in the rain/wet. So my time/miles are down for February. Fitness wise I am really feeling good and the work interruption last week (missed 3 days) turned out to be okay.
So my 20's with the recently adusted levels are feeling pretty solid now on consecutive training days and now I just need to get those duration times up. I have just enough residual fatigue and not too much that it interferes with the next training session, but I cannot wait until we start getting some better Saturday weather to start going back to the 5 hour routes. The mix between weekday 60 minute sessions (because that is all the time I have available) and then the longer less intense weekend sessions is a groove that I am really liking.
js, keep up the drive. Looking forward to hearing more of your progress.
I've been focusing on efforts with a IF >= 0.85 in 90min and 120min doses. Today I ripped off 165min of SST and v02max hills. The middle 2 hours had an IF of 0.91 and approximated the IF I had during a 2 hour hilly road race last June. I felt like I could have done more so I am feeling like I have improved since June. Riding for under 3 hours instead of 4-5 hours allows me to keep the intensity up without worrying about completely wiping myself out. I think that might a good thing. I'm going to still try to get out for a long slow one once a week as my first race is about 8 hours long.
Sounds like to me that your thoughts of work getting in the way of gains is not going to happen. Solid 60 minutes of L4 is nice!! I love when I can hit those especially on the 2nd hour of my insane rides. Honestly work/personal life got in the way mentally today. Friday was a shoot day and I was going to ride Saturday and Sunday with atleast one insane day. Well Thursday night I get a great surprise that my new mac powerbook came back, souped up and ready to do film editing but everything went downhill from there.
The crew and actors really ****** me off Friday as they made an easy day, tough and than Saturday I was so excited about the computer that I did not ride. I had to re-arrange the office to make it all work. I even went to BB to get the Toshiba special on sale for a nice 1080p hdmi monitor. The moving around should have taken a couple hours but instead took my whole day!! All the wires all had to be re-patched and setup and than I bought one wrong piece!! So I loose out on Saturday!!
So I am driving to work today and see guys already coming back from the first race in CP (I think atleast). Got the numbers pinned on. But in first weekend in March? Seemed early and it was like 18 degrees out. Anyway got the blood going but the CT was being whacky as the loose wire would just not work this time so I could not get the watts up in ERG mode but after 30 minutes messing with it and some duct tape, got it to work. I was doing well and wanted to hit hour 2 with a solid 200-210. 1hr 40 in and bleah....
Oh well there is always tomorrow. I did atleast get a 140 TSS anyway. Just to top it off the landlord for the factory called me today to say the check for my NYC company who has part of the 3rd floor bounced and I need to replace it tomorrow. Just another day in my whacky life!! Sorry for venting but we all need it.
On the cycling front I will do a gradual raise tomorrow and switched my 53 with a 50 after the ride today. I want to give it a try tomorrow in the 50 and how I perform.
-js
Last I went back to the doc and the L4-L5 looks great even I could see the difference from the PRP but the L5-S1 went no where and I remember during the injection he could not get in there as I was almost past out from the pain. I will be going for my next round after I get back from Gainseville which as insane as that sounds I am looking forward to and want to see what he can do with the L5-S1. My wife almost through me out of the house for wanting to do it again.
^^ I can empathise with you JS about life stuff getting int he way. I lost a good day of training last week with similar stuff /img/vbsmilies/smilies/frown.gif
Still, I managed a good 2hr tempo ride again Friday, although couldnt quite hit last weeks numbers despite a similar RPE, and then a short 'opener' session on Saturday, which seemed to do the trick nicely as my legs were feeling really good from the start of the season opener (for me) event today. Only 75 miles and 5000ft climbing but a good roling route and the sort of thing that usually has my legs hurting by the end. I was slightly nervous about how strong I'd be over the distance with the lack of long rides in the last few months, but I needn't have worried. Despite just not finding a group to work with, I had a great ride and felt good right to the end. I rode away from the starting group, to the sounds of tuts and various comments about 'racing' but they were simply dawdling along and as it was 0 degs C I needed to warm up and didnt want to turn this into a recovery pace ride! Needless to say I didnt see them again and rode a good steady pace the entire way with a mindset that this was a good 4.5hr training ride - steady L3 on climbs, L4 if it got steep and used the descents for some recovery before pushing on at L2/3 on the flats . Truth be told I think I slightly under-paced it on a few of the rolling bits as I felt fresh as a daisy within 5 mins of crossing the line! 75 miles, 4hr 23m, AP180w, NP 210w (reflecting the rolling nature of the course) and 236TSS. About the same power numbers as my best for the time, but I certainly felt stronger and less fatigued compared to that ride, so I hope a good sign.
Work continues to be fairly slow into March, so I'm hoping there's time for lots more miles in the next couple of weeks to build on this start. Weather looks wet though so might be time to brave the elements...
Still, I managed a good 2hr tempo ride again Friday, although couldnt quite hit last weeks numbers despite a similar RPE, and then a short 'opener' session on Saturday, which seemed to do the trick nicely as my legs were feeling really good from the start of the season opener (for me) event today. Only 75 miles and 5000ft climbing but a good roling route and the sort of thing that usually has my legs hurting by the end. I was slightly nervous about how strong I'd be over the distance with the lack of long rides in the last few months, but I needn't have worried. Despite just not finding a group to work with, I had a great ride and felt good right to the end. I rode away from the starting group, to the sounds of tuts and various comments about 'racing' but they were simply dawdling along and as it was 0 degs C I needed to warm up and didnt want to turn this into a recovery pace ride! Needless to say I didnt see them again and rode a good steady pace the entire way with a mindset that this was a good 4.5hr training ride - steady L3 on climbs, L4 if it got steep and used the descents for some recovery before pushing on at L2/3 on the flats . Truth be told I think I slightly under-paced it on a few of the rolling bits as I felt fresh as a daisy within 5 mins of crossing the line! 75 miles, 4hr 23m, AP180w, NP 210w (reflecting the rolling nature of the course) and 236TSS. About the same power numbers as my best for the time, but I certainly felt stronger and less fatigued compared to that ride, so I hope a good sign.
Work continues to be fairly slow into March, so I'm hoping there's time for lots more miles in the next couple of weeks to build on this start. Weather looks wet though so might be time to brave the elements...
Wow, TWO days in a row with the sun shining and temps approaching 30F. It's almost like southern California here in Minnesota. It won't last though: forecast says 5-9 inches of snow on Monday. I made the most of it and did 517 TSS in 2 days, 1023 TSS in the last 5 days: ATL 155, TSB -36. I'm tired. I'm going to take Monday off and maybe make a snowman or something.
Yow, that's a big dose of training. Regroup with those snowman sessions and you'll likely bounce back in a very good way. Good job jumpin' on the weather break!
-Dave
Ok, after 5 long weeks, the last two while very productive on paper and consistent have been completed with a significant amount of fatigue. I have hit my goals both in my 90% workouts and for the most part in my limited VO2. I decided to cap off this block with a long weekend of hills. I modified the week to have the best weekend possible. I felt like I had a great day yesterday 5.5hrs 330 TSS, today not so much (3.5 hr @ 215TSS) Downloading the files, on paper yesterday was a good day with lots of solid VO2 efforts, one was nearly 7 minutes @ 110%, the hill ended, my legs were starting to fade and I felt O2 deprived. However, looking at my HR, I was not even to my typical 20 min avg HR at the end of 7 minutes!! This was consistent throughout the day and has been consistent in all of my VO2 work the past 2 weeks. I think I said earlier my HR for 90% efforts have looked more like 80% efforts the past 2 weeks. I know HR is a poor indicator, but for me it has been somewhat consistent over the years and I am not just 1 or 2 bpm off, I am 10 or 15. So with testing coming up, should I try to start my pace at that 110% number for my 20 minute? If I am wrong and it is just some thing my HR has gone into as a result of fatigue that effort is going to hurt like hell the last 10 minutes!
You should try to pace the test the same way you'd pace a time trial on steady terrain. I'm not sure what you're referencing your 110% to, but you should target 100% or perhaps a tiny bit less of your expected power from the test just as you would in a iso-power paced time trial. Don't try to front load it by going 10% above your target pace, that's far more likely to lead to fade and a lower overall number at the end just as it often does in time trials.
If you're referring to 110% of your current best for the duration in hopes that you're a lot fitter then it depends on how confident you are in being able to sustain 110% of your current best for the whole test duration. When it doubt it's always better to start a bit easier but then lay into it after the first four to six minutes and keep building all the way to the end if there's any more to give.
-Dave
The 110% comes from the fact that I have been doing 110% for 5-7 minute durations and while my legs are fatigued from the significant workload over the past few weeks, by the end my HR is not even to what I would expect from an average 20 minutes. When I first started using power and was not really aware of what I could do, for TTs I would still go by HR and keep the power # to pace myself once settled in. I may go back to this for my test as I have never experienced such a discrepancy in HR to power as I have the past 2 weeks. My HR says I am not even in the ballpark on any of my efforts.
Whatever works for you, but if I'm doing a power test (or advising a coaching client on power tests) I don't use HR to guide my power test. That can lead to all kinds of self limiting tests depending on how your HR is responding on the day of the test.
If you're doing say a 20 minute test I'd start targeting your average power for your recent typical 20 minute intervals. Hold that for at least three to four minutes and then build from there as best you can manage but don't just sprint up to a higher power. Keep ramping it up and trying to dig deeper for more power. By the ten minute mark or so you'll know if you can push harder or whether you just have to dig deep to hang on as best you can. Lay it all out there by attempting to build all the way to the end if possible but ideally there's not enough left for any kind of sprint or last minute burst.
If you want to race time trials you should spend some time working on this all out pacing until you dial it in. It's roughly guided by power in the opening minutes to make sure you're not way out of your ideal target zone but then it's mostly RPE as the effort progresses with only some spot checking on power to make sure your staying focused and not getting complacent. Getting good at this will pay off big time in time trials, in late race solo breaks, and of course for future power tests. You may not dial it on the first try but you'll at least assess a lowball number for your capabilities and with practice you'll get better at it.
-Dave
If you're doing say a 20 minute test I'd start targeting your average power for your recent typical 20 minute intervals. Hold that for at least three to four minutes and then build from there as best you can manage but don't just sprint up to a higher power. Keep ramping it up and trying to dig deeper for more power. By the ten minute mark or so you'll know if you can push harder or whether you just have to dig deep to hang on as best you can. Lay it all out there by attempting to build all the way to the end if possible but ideally there's not enough left for any kind of sprint or last minute burst.
If you want to race time trials you should spend some time working on this all out pacing until you dial it in. It's roughly guided by power in the opening minutes to make sure you're not way out of your ideal target zone but then it's mostly RPE as the effort progresses with only some spot checking on power to make sure your staying focused and not getting complacent. Getting good at this will pay off big time in time trials, in late race solo breaks, and of course for future power tests. You may not dial it on the first try but you'll at least assess a lowball number for your capabilities and with practice you'll get better at it.
-Dave
Of all things I sneezed yesterday morning and popped a rib head out or at least that is how it feels. If you have experienced that you know that is a very annoying discomfort that almost causes one to take in shorter breaths of air to minimize the annoyance. Nevertheless I was able to train yesterday with this issue and eeked out 93% on the first interval and 91% on the second with a 90 TSS total. Position on the bike and breathing harder just enhanced the annoyance. I did not get to train outside this weekend. Saturday was 2 1/2 hour on the rollers with 130 TSS.
I thought I popped the rib back in last night (there was an audible pop right at the location), but evidently is still out a little based on how it feels this morning. Trained legs this morning okay and will hopefully be back on the rollers tonight and for the next several evenings.
What I am really anticipating is a warm up and dry weekend ahead - finally.
If it does stay dry I hope to get out on my 80 mile route. I am really looking forward to the long weekend rides.
Last March I was doing 70+ miles every Saturday and was in really good shape to start stretching toward the 100 mark at good sustainable speed. I feel a bit behind this year on that goal, but I do feel ahead as far as pushing the FTP ceiling upward. I think it is more a matter of getting the mind and body right for extended time on the saddle than the legs and heart.
I thought I popped the rib back in last night (there was an audible pop right at the location), but evidently is still out a little based on how it feels this morning. Trained legs this morning okay and will hopefully be back on the rollers tonight and for the next several evenings.
What I am really anticipating is a warm up and dry weekend ahead - finally.
If it does stay dry I hope to get out on my 80 mile route. I am really looking forward to the long weekend rides.
Last March I was doing 70+ miles every Saturday and was in really good shape to start stretching toward the 100 mark at good sustainable speed. I feel a bit behind this year on that goal, but I do feel ahead as far as pushing the FTP ceiling upward. I think it is more a matter of getting the mind and body right for extended time on the saddle than the legs and heart.
Bummer about the rib Felt. I've done that twice in the last few years, both in weird ways, no big accidents or anything just stretching it wrong while going about day to day things. It sucks because the soft tissue around ribs bruises very easily and stays painful for quite a while. In both my cases it was several weeks of hoping I didn't sneeze and trying not to laugh. The good news is that after the first few days I could ride pretty hard in a steady way but jumping out of the saddle or sprinting was very painful.
Hang in there, not much you can do about it but just let it heal. You don't want to tape or wrap ribs in general as you don't want to obstruct depth of breathing at all.
Good luck,
-Dave
Hang in there, not much you can do about it but just let it heal. You don't want to tape or wrap ribs in general as you don't want to obstruct depth of breathing at all.
Good luck,
-Dave
sorry to hear that Felt - sounds a little nasty!
I have better news though as they posted the times for yesterdays event - I was 34th fastest out of a field of about 550 or so. It was sold out at 600 people but looking through there was the usual number of DNS. Obviously it wasnt a race, and I'm sure some people could have been riding harder if they wanted, but I'm really happy with that given I rode it mostly solo and took a quick feedstation stop so its a good confidence boost that the training is doing its job and my pacing plan worked well. I'm sure i could have gone harder as well, as I went out today in some lovely spring sunshine and managed a good solid 90 min tempo effort today and wasnt finding it too tough despite 235 TSS yesterday. i think this shows the difference when I ride without going over threshold power too often as I can recover well from those efforts.
Good boost to keep on with all the hard work. Hope you guys with early races also get good news.
I have better news though as they posted the times for yesterdays event - I was 34th fastest out of a field of about 550 or so. It was sold out at 600 people but looking through there was the usual number of DNS. Obviously it wasnt a race, and I'm sure some people could have been riding harder if they wanted, but I'm really happy with that given I rode it mostly solo and took a quick feedstation stop so its a good confidence boost that the training is doing its job and my pacing plan worked well. I'm sure i could have gone harder as well, as I went out today in some lovely spring sunshine and managed a good solid 90 min tempo effort today and wasnt finding it too tough despite 235 TSS yesterday. i think this shows the difference when I ride without going over threshold power too often as I can recover well from those efforts.
Good boost to keep on with all the hard work. Hope you guys with early races also get good news.
Thanks Dave and Bp
bp, it is not near as bad as an illness that can put one off the bike or training. Like Dave mentioned I was able to train into L4 and hold that pretty good. It is just a bit uncomfortable is all. I would take this any day over a bronchial/respiratory type illness.
Good work on the ride. That is always a confidence booster especially since you did that mostly solo.
Well tested my 1min and 5min today, FTP test is tomorrow. I just can't seem to get a good 1min on the trainer, went out way to hard and kinda trashed the effort. Even miss paced it was my highest 1min on a trainer and with weight loss it bumped my 1min to 8.54 watt/kg. Can't wait to get an actual outdoor max! My 5 min was all I had and was a great effort @ 442 watts. My previous trainer high was 419 and my last test 400, so huge improvement all around. This combined with weight loss puts me @ 5.74 watt/kg. Tomorrow is my FTP test and if I look at relation of what I tested previous to my 5min, I should be thinking 365-375, but we will see. One odd thing I have noticed on my last 3 5min tests was that my HR will be steady till the last 30 seconds and then instantly jump 10-15bpm. It is pretty odd as my power is actually lower most of the time.
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