A
AndrewJ
Guest
Is it just my imagination, or are there actually less cars out there?
Seems to me that it is starting to reduce slightly.
Roll on $2 per litre.
Seems to me that it is starting to reduce slightly.
Roll on $2 per litre.
T
Theo Bekkers
Guest
AndrewJ wrote:
> Is it just my imagination, or are there actually less cars out there?
> Seems to me that it is starting to reduce slightly.
>
> Roll on $2 per litre.
And bananas at $20 per kilo.
Theo
> Is it just my imagination, or are there actually less cars out there?
> Seems to me that it is starting to reduce slightly.
>
> Roll on $2 per litre.
And bananas at $20 per kilo.
Theo
C
Claude
Guest
"AndrewJ" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Is it just my imagination, or are there actually less cars out there?
> Seems to me that it is starting to reduce slightly.
My wife commutes along Heidelberg Rd (Melbourne) and swears there are fewer
cars around to ruin her daily cycle since the price of petrol sky-rocketed
news:[email protected]...
> Is it just my imagination, or are there actually less cars out there?
> Seems to me that it is starting to reduce slightly.
My wife commutes along Heidelberg Rd (Melbourne) and swears there are fewer
cars around to ruin her daily cycle since the price of petrol sky-rocketed
G
Graeme Dods
Guest
AndrewJ wrote:
> Is it just my imagination, or are there actually less cars out there?
> Seems to me that it is starting to reduce slightly.
>
> Roll on $2 per litre.
And why the hell do they decide to massively subsidise conversion to
LPG[1]? By negating one of the most effective limiting factors to car
use they're just delaying the inevitable.
Graeme
[1] Other than pandering to the masses and buying votes of course.
> Is it just my imagination, or are there actually less cars out there?
> Seems to me that it is starting to reduce slightly.
>
> Roll on $2 per litre.
And why the hell do they decide to massively subsidise conversion to
LPG[1]? By negating one of the most effective limiting factors to car
use they're just delaying the inevitable.
Graeme
[1] Other than pandering to the masses and buying votes of course.
D
Donga
Guest
AndrewJ wrote:
> Is it just my imagination, or are there actually less cars out there?
> Seems to me that it is starting to reduce slightly.
>
> Roll on $2 per litre.
Thanks ya *******. I have three kids who are involved in a lot of
activities. It simply can't be done without driving. This petrol hike
is killing me financially and the only thing I could do about it is
pull them out of their sports, debating, choir, theatre sports, etc.
Wishing for that to happen is mean and nasty. The ideal world is one
where we have unlimited access to whatever we want, but choose to use
only what we need.
Donga
> Is it just my imagination, or are there actually less cars out there?
> Seems to me that it is starting to reduce slightly.
>
> Roll on $2 per litre.
Thanks ya *******. I have three kids who are involved in a lot of
activities. It simply can't be done without driving. This petrol hike
is killing me financially and the only thing I could do about it is
pull them out of their sports, debating, choir, theatre sports, etc.
Wishing for that to happen is mean and nasty. The ideal world is one
where we have unlimited access to whatever we want, but choose to use
only what we need.
Donga
B
Bleve
Guest
Graeme Dods wrote:
> AndrewJ wrote:
> > Is it just my imagination, or are there actually less cars out there?
> > Seems to me that it is starting to reduce slightly.
> >
> > Roll on $2 per litre.
>
> And why the hell do they decide to massively subsidise conversion to
> LPG[1]? By negating one of the most effective limiting factors to car
> use they're just delaying the inevitable.
>
> Graeme
>
> [1] Other than pandering to the masses and buying votes of course.
Because Howard is pandering to the masses and buying votes, of course.
Rather than lead (perish the thought ... this federal government?!),
they're just sweeping the problem under the carpet for another 4 years.
Ride yer bike ...
> AndrewJ wrote:
> > Is it just my imagination, or are there actually less cars out there?
> > Seems to me that it is starting to reduce slightly.
> >
> > Roll on $2 per litre.
>
> And why the hell do they decide to massively subsidise conversion to
> LPG[1]? By negating one of the most effective limiting factors to car
> use they're just delaying the inevitable.
>
> Graeme
>
> [1] Other than pandering to the masses and buying votes of course.
Because Howard is pandering to the masses and buying votes, of course.
Rather than lead (perish the thought ... this federal government?!),
they're just sweeping the problem under the carpet for another 4 years.
Ride yer bike ...
T
Theo Bekkers
Guest
Graeme Dods wrote:
> And why the hell do they decide to massively subsidise conversion to
> LPG[1]? By negating one of the most effective limiting factors to car
> use they're just delaying the inevitable.
Did you hear Howard mention that there are currently damn-all taxes on LPG
(other than GST) and that these taxes will be ramped up until in 2012 they
will be the same as those on Petrol? No? Maybe he forgot he passed
those changes last year?
Theo
> And why the hell do they decide to massively subsidise conversion to
> LPG[1]? By negating one of the most effective limiting factors to car
> use they're just delaying the inevitable.
Did you hear Howard mention that there are currently damn-all taxes on LPG
(other than GST) and that these taxes will be ramped up until in 2012 they
will be the same as those on Petrol? No? Maybe he forgot he passed
those changes last year?
Theo
S
Stuart Lamble
Guest
On 2006-08-15, Theo Bekkers <[email protected]> wrote:
> Graeme Dods wrote:
>
>> And why the hell do they decide to massively subsidise conversion to
>> LPG[1]? By negating one of the most effective limiting factors to car
>> use they're just delaying the inevitable.
>
> Did you hear Howard mention that there are currently damn-all taxes on LPG
> (other than GST) and that these taxes will be ramped up until in 2012 they
> will be the same as those on Petrol? No? Maybe he forgot he passed
> those changes last year?
Cite? This would be a classic example of spin in action ...
--
My Usenet From: address now expires after two weeks. If you email me, and
the mail bounces, try changing the bit before the "@" to "usenet".
> Graeme Dods wrote:
>
>> And why the hell do they decide to massively subsidise conversion to
>> LPG[1]? By negating one of the most effective limiting factors to car
>> use they're just delaying the inevitable.
>
> Did you hear Howard mention that there are currently damn-all taxes on LPG
> (other than GST) and that these taxes will be ramped up until in 2012 they
> will be the same as those on Petrol? No? Maybe he forgot he passed
> those changes last year?
Cite? This would be a classic example of spin in action ...
--
My Usenet From: address now expires after two weeks. If you email me, and
the mail bounces, try changing the bit before the "@" to "usenet".
B
Bleve
Guest
Donga wrote:
> AndrewJ wrote:
> > Is it just my imagination, or are there actually less cars out there?
> > Seems to me that it is starting to reduce slightly.
> >
> > Roll on $2 per litre.
>
> Thanks ya *******. I have three kids who are involved in a lot of
> activities. It simply can't be done without driving. This petrol hike
> is killing me financially and the only thing I could do about it is
> pull them out of their sports, debating, choir, theatre sports, etc.
> Wishing for that to happen is mean and nasty. The ideal world is one
> where we have unlimited access to whatever we want, but choose to use
> only what we need.
When it hits $10 a litre, what will you do?
Seriously, this problem is not going to go away. The world *will*
change.
> AndrewJ wrote:
> > Is it just my imagination, or are there actually less cars out there?
> > Seems to me that it is starting to reduce slightly.
> >
> > Roll on $2 per litre.
>
> Thanks ya *******. I have three kids who are involved in a lot of
> activities. It simply can't be done without driving. This petrol hike
> is killing me financially and the only thing I could do about it is
> pull them out of their sports, debating, choir, theatre sports, etc.
> Wishing for that to happen is mean and nasty. The ideal world is one
> where we have unlimited access to whatever we want, but choose to use
> only what we need.
When it hits $10 a litre, what will you do?
Seriously, this problem is not going to go away. The world *will*
change.
F
Friday
Guest
Donga wrote:
> AndrewJ wrote:
>
>>Is it just my imagination, or are there actually less cars out there?
>>Seems to me that it is starting to reduce slightly.
>>
>>Roll on $2 per litre.
>
>
> Thanks ya *******. I have three kids who are involved in a lot of
> activities. It simply can't be done without driving. This petrol hike
> is killing me financially and the only thing I could do about it is
> pull them out of their sports, debating, choir, theatre sports, etc.
> Wishing for that to happen is mean and nasty. The ideal world is one
> where we have unlimited access to whatever we want, but choose to use
> only what we need.
>
> Donga
>
When I was a kid if I wanted to go somewhere I had to walk or ride my
bike. Choir, debating and theatre didn't exist back then, never did me
any harm.
Friday
> AndrewJ wrote:
>
>>Is it just my imagination, or are there actually less cars out there?
>>Seems to me that it is starting to reduce slightly.
>>
>>Roll on $2 per litre.
>
>
> Thanks ya *******. I have three kids who are involved in a lot of
> activities. It simply can't be done without driving. This petrol hike
> is killing me financially and the only thing I could do about it is
> pull them out of their sports, debating, choir, theatre sports, etc.
> Wishing for that to happen is mean and nasty. The ideal world is one
> where we have unlimited access to whatever we want, but choose to use
> only what we need.
>
> Donga
>
When I was a kid if I wanted to go somewhere I had to walk or ride my
bike. Choir, debating and theatre didn't exist back then, never did me
any harm.
Friday
D
Donga
Guest
Friday wrote:
> When I was a kid if I wanted to go somewhere I had to walk or ride my
> bike. Choir, debating and theatre didn't exist back then, never did me
> any harm.
Nor did gears on bikes when my dad cycled. Do you ride a single speed
with coaster brake because of that argument? Come to think of it, my
recent forebears struggled to afford chaff for their horse.
> When I was a kid if I wanted to go somewhere I had to walk or ride my
> bike. Choir, debating and theatre didn't exist back then, never did me
> any harm.
Nor did gears on bikes when my dad cycled. Do you ride a single speed
with coaster brake because of that argument? Come to think of it, my
recent forebears struggled to afford chaff for their horse.
D
Donga
Guest
Bleve wrote:
> When it hits $10 a litre, what will you do?
>
> Seriously, this problem is not going to go away. The world *will*
> change.
That's obvious enough. Wishing for it to happen is still mean and
nasty. Like many people we are economising to afford what is important,
and some of the changes will get less and less fun.
Donga
> When it hits $10 a litre, what will you do?
>
> Seriously, this problem is not going to go away. The world *will*
> change.
That's obvious enough. Wishing for it to happen is still mean and
nasty. Like many people we are economising to afford what is important,
and some of the changes will get less and less fun.
Donga
T
Theo Bekkers
Guest
Stuart Lamble wrote:
> Theo Bekkers wrote:
>> Did you hear Howard mention that there are currently damn-all taxes
>> on LPG (other than GST) and that these taxes will be ramped up until
>> in 2012 they will be the same as those on Petrol? No?
>> Maybe he forgot he passed those changes last year?
>
> Cite? This would be a classic example of spin in action ...
http://www.aph.gov.au/Library/Pubs/RN/2003-04/04rn44.htm
They appear to now be proposing an excise tax of only 12.5 c per litre, but
that leaves them with an energy excise shortfall of 13.4c on LPG. Coming
soon to a servo near you.
Theo
> Theo Bekkers wrote:
>> Did you hear Howard mention that there are currently damn-all taxes
>> on LPG (other than GST) and that these taxes will be ramped up until
>> in 2012 they will be the same as those on Petrol? No?
>> Maybe he forgot he passed those changes last year?
>
> Cite? This would be a classic example of spin in action ...
http://www.aph.gov.au/Library/Pubs/RN/2003-04/04rn44.htm
They appear to now be proposing an excise tax of only 12.5 c per litre, but
that leaves them with an energy excise shortfall of 13.4c on LPG. Coming
soon to a servo near you.
Theo
Bleve said:
The worrying part is, even if we only ride bikes, we are not immune from this in any way. Imagine postage/freight costs, air fairs, FOOD. Damn it, I like my food!
My hope is that the kids' sports will become better organised... currently the travel involved in getting kids to games is ridiculous, sometimes driving for twice the time the game actually takesDonga said:
It's not a good use of resources, and means instead of the youngsters having, say, 3 hours of possible activity, they spend 2 hours sitting in a car. Bring back local leagues!!!
ali
B
Bleve
Guest
Donga wrote:
> Bleve wrote:
> > When it hits $10 a litre, what will you do?
> >
> > Seriously, this problem is not going to go away. The world *will*
> > change.
>
> That's obvious enough. Wishing for it to happen is still mean and
> nasty. Like many people we are economising to afford what is important,
> and some of the changes will get less and less fun.
That depends on your point of view. When petrol costs so much that
people have to *seriously* look at alternative means of transport, that
can have a positive effect as well as negative. Cars *are*
unsustainable, car culture is *deadly* How many die each year in cars?
more Australians have died in car crashes than in all the wars we've
ever been involved in etc etc.
If we get a little smart about transport, and anticipate the
consequences of the (all too foreseable, alas ... but people *are*
stupid) choices made re where we live, how we get to places we want to
go, where we send our kids to school etc, then it's actually not so
bad. The kids can ride their bikes to wherever they want to go, unless
it's stupidly far away, in which case, the consequences of
unsustainable choices are going to smack the people that have made
those choices, and they have no-one to blame but themselves.
> Bleve wrote:
> > When it hits $10 a litre, what will you do?
> >
> > Seriously, this problem is not going to go away. The world *will*
> > change.
>
> That's obvious enough. Wishing for it to happen is still mean and
> nasty. Like many people we are economising to afford what is important,
> and some of the changes will get less and less fun.
That depends on your point of view. When petrol costs so much that
people have to *seriously* look at alternative means of transport, that
can have a positive effect as well as negative. Cars *are*
unsustainable, car culture is *deadly* How many die each year in cars?
more Australians have died in car crashes than in all the wars we've
ever been involved in etc etc.
If we get a little smart about transport, and anticipate the
consequences of the (all too foreseable, alas ... but people *are*
stupid) choices made re where we live, how we get to places we want to
go, where we send our kids to school etc, then it's actually not so
bad. The kids can ride their bikes to wherever they want to go, unless
it's stupidly far away, in which case, the consequences of
unsustainable choices are going to smack the people that have made
those choices, and they have no-one to blame but themselves.
gplama said:
Freight? Logistics? Unless there is a immediate shift to returning Australia's freight requirements back to rolling stock, we could be potentially in for a very rude shock regarding food prices. So why don't food producers grow stuff closer to the population centers??
Well they could of once, before the brick and tile wonderlands took over the market gardens & orchards in the post-war suburb sprawl. Not now, the McMansions have stuffed that option.
B
BrettS
Guest
Theo Bekkers wrote:
> Stuart Lamble wrote:
>
>>Theo Bekkers wrote:
>
>
>>>Did you hear Howard mention that there are currently damn-all taxes
>>>on LPG (other than GST) and that these taxes will be ramped up until
>>>in 2012 they will be the same as those on Petrol? No?
>>>Maybe he forgot he passed those changes last year?
>>
>>Cite? This would be a classic example of spin in action ...
>
>
> http://www.aph.gov.au/Library/Pubs/RN/2003-04/04rn44.htm
>
> They appear to now be proposing an excise tax of only 12.5 c per litre, but
> that leaves them with an energy excise shortfall of 13.4c on LPG. Coming
> soon to a servo near you.
>
Which is more than compensated for by the 4.3c/L 'surplus' on petrol
given the likely usage ratios.
The nerd/mechanic/inventor/tinkerer in me still thinks that a
HPV/electric hybrid is the go. Battery charged by a wind turbine (I
live near the coast), or a solar farm in my tornado ravaged back yard.
--
BrettS
> Stuart Lamble wrote:
>
>>Theo Bekkers wrote:
>
>
>>>Did you hear Howard mention that there are currently damn-all taxes
>>>on LPG (other than GST) and that these taxes will be ramped up until
>>>in 2012 they will be the same as those on Petrol? No?
>>>Maybe he forgot he passed those changes last year?
>>
>>Cite? This would be a classic example of spin in action ...
>
>
> http://www.aph.gov.au/Library/Pubs/RN/2003-04/04rn44.htm
>
> They appear to now be proposing an excise tax of only 12.5 c per litre, but
> that leaves them with an energy excise shortfall of 13.4c on LPG. Coming
> soon to a servo near you.
>
Which is more than compensated for by the 4.3c/L 'surplus' on petrol
given the likely usage ratios.
The nerd/mechanic/inventor/tinkerer in me still thinks that a
HPV/electric hybrid is the go. Battery charged by a wind turbine (I
live near the coast), or a solar farm in my tornado ravaged back yard.
--
BrettS
Yes, i have noticed that a lot of amateur sporting organizations either have, or are considering geographic proximity when allocating teams to divisions. A lot of junior competitions are run like this already and have been for a long time. It makes sense, and you can still have your cup type events or carnivals for sports like soccer, basketball and netball.alison_b said:My hope is that the kids' sports will become better organised... currently the travel involved in getting kids to games is ridiculous, sometimes driving for twice the time the game actually takes
Bring back local leagues!!!
ali
These changes will hit us all, which is why it is annoying that politicians (predictably) take the easy route, because most of them wont be around when the sh*t hits the fan. Changes could be made now that would start addressing the problem realistically but they won't happen while people still think this is solely a problem of the greed of oil companies and governments rather than a physical reality only exacerbated by those factors.
Pretty much par for the course in a country that has never been notable for people adapting to the reality of its physical environment, witness housing design, land use based upon European rainfall patterns and soil and the numerous attempts at transplanting inappropriate foreign species into Australian ecologies.
D
Donga
Guest
Bleve wrote:
> If we get a little smart about transport, and anticipate the
> consequences of the (all too foreseable, alas ... but people *are*
> stupid) choices made re where we live, how we get to places we want to
> go, where we send our kids to school etc, then it's actually not so
> bad. The kids can ride their bikes to wherever they want to go, unless
> it's stupidly far away, in which case, the consequences of
> unsustainable choices are going to smack the people that have made
> those choices, and they have no-one to blame but themselves.
Unfortunately houses within cooee of the kids' school start at $1
million for a dump. I live 12 minutes drive away on a good run. I can
ride it in 18 and do when it's just me and I don't need to be
'dressed'. It's not a safe ride for my kids, nor could they do it
practically with the varying hours and the gear they need. Sure there
are choices in all this. I could use the local high and primary
schools, for demonstrably worse educational outcomes. We could decide
not do all the other activities. The extra benefits my kids get are
part of the richness of life in Brisbane/Australia in 2006, for those
who can afford it. That means driving. Talking about blaming myself is
silly. Should I choose to forego what is on offer for my kids? Heck,
I'd better move to the country and live in a humpy while I'm at it.
Donga
> If we get a little smart about transport, and anticipate the
> consequences of the (all too foreseable, alas ... but people *are*
> stupid) choices made re where we live, how we get to places we want to
> go, where we send our kids to school etc, then it's actually not so
> bad. The kids can ride their bikes to wherever they want to go, unless
> it's stupidly far away, in which case, the consequences of
> unsustainable choices are going to smack the people that have made
> those choices, and they have no-one to blame but themselves.
Unfortunately houses within cooee of the kids' school start at $1
million for a dump. I live 12 minutes drive away on a good run. I can
ride it in 18 and do when it's just me and I don't need to be
'dressed'. It's not a safe ride for my kids, nor could they do it
practically with the varying hours and the gear they need. Sure there
are choices in all this. I could use the local high and primary
schools, for demonstrably worse educational outcomes. We could decide
not do all the other activities. The extra benefits my kids get are
part of the richness of life in Brisbane/Australia in 2006, for those
who can afford it. That means driving. Talking about blaming myself is
silly. Should I choose to forego what is on offer for my kids? Heck,
I'd better move to the country and live in a humpy while I'm at it.
Donga
