opinions/advise please!

[roadster99]

need some opinions/advise on which route would be more beneficial to overall training.

route 1: there are 3 hills near my apartment. they all run for just about 2 miles long. each hill has a different gradient, but i can't tell you how steep each one is. but just for "example" purposes, we will say cat2, cat3, cat4. my route would be each hill twice, close to max each time.

route 2: there is a hill in town, avg gradient is 8%. the hill runs for about 4.5 miles. my route would be twice up & down the hill, close to max each time.

my question would be which route would be more beneficial? the 3 shorter hill climbs, twice each hill, or the one longer hill climb, twice?

 

[Alex Simmons]

need some opinions/advise on which route would be more beneficial to overall training.

route 1: there are 3 hills near my apartment. they all run for just about 2 miles long. each hill has a different gradient, but i can't tell you how steep each one is. but just for "example" purposes, we will say cat2, cat3, cat4. my route would be each hill twice, close to max each time.

route 2: there is a hill in town, avg gradient is 8%. the hill runs for about 4.5 miles. my route would be twice up & down the hill, close to max each time.

my question would be which route would be more beneficial? the 3 shorter hill climbs, twice each hill, or the one longer hill climb, twice?

Beneficial for what specifically? Short intense hills will train the "engine" for dealing with short intense hills. Longer hills will train the engine for longer hills (presuming your pacing will be maximal sustainable for the length / gradient of the climb). What's important to you and what element of your current capabilities needs the most work?

 

[roadster99]

Beneficial for what specifically? Short intense hills will train the "engine" for dealing with short intense hills. Longer hills will train the engine for longer hills (presuming your pacing will be maximal sustainable for the length / gradient of the climb). What's important to you and what element of your current capabilities needs the most work?

what is important to me is overall strength & conditioning. what needs the most work is the strength/power aspect of riding along with greater vo2 (i assume); for example, i don't mind the steady-state climbing, but ask me to accelerate or attack on a hill? yeah right...my heart rate screams through the roof & i just can't respond. my style of climbing would be a higher cadence style. i have trouble "grinding" out a big gear up a hill, so i guess as a result i have a higher heart rate while climbing. usually while i climb, i avg about 170bpm & can usually keep my breathing under decent control. but as soon as i get up out of the saddle & basically try to do anything, 185+ & i'm gassed. so will any of these hill repeats do any good for what i am shooting for?

 

[Alex Simmons]

but as soon as i get up out of the saddle & basically try to do anything, 185+ & i'm gassed. so will any of these hill repeats do any good for what i am shooting for?

Well training your weaknesses is a good thing, so how about trying to create those scenarios in your hill efforts?

If you are climbing and are at your maximal sustainable pace (for a long climb), then there's only so much you can do when forced to go over that pace.

It may be that you need to either (or both):

- raise your "limit" in the first place by various types of longer hardish efforts from 15 - 120 min at various sub-maximal intensities (see power levels L2 to L4 in that table referenced in this item)

- raise your ability to regularly go over your limit with shorter very hard efforts ranging from 30 sec - 5 min at maximal to supra-maximal intensities (akin to power levels L5 and L6 in the same item)

 

[roadster99]

Well training your weaknesses is a good thing, so how about trying to create those scenarios in your hill efforts?

If you are climbing and are at your maximal sustainable pace (for a long climb), then there's only so much you can do when forced to go over that pace.

It may be that you need to either (or both):

- raise your "limit" in the first place by various types of longer hardish efforts from 15 - 120 min at various sub-maximal intensities (see power levels L2 to L4 in that table referenced in this item)

- raise your ability to regularly go over your limit with shorter very hard efforts ranging from 30 sec - 5 min at maximal to supra-maximal intensities (akin to power levels L5 and L6 in the same item)

thanks alex for the help. particularly the chart. sometimes people get so technical when it comes to the different levels of training that it makes it hard to understand for people like me who don't make cycling their full time job. but that chart is pretty user friendly. thanks for the advise.

 

[tfstrum]

I'd alternate so that no one hill would be totally predictable. Take them in different gears, stand more on one day versus another, go out at different times of the day. Use every road you can and change up your routine.

 

[roadster99]

alex, just wondering. so much emphasis is put on quality, not quantity. it seems that for people with budgeted time, just going out for a ride with out a specific goal in mind doesn't really produce much results; maybe just geting the body prepared for long hours in the saddle. with that in mind, which ride would you say is more quality than quantity? or are they both quality, just different ways of getting to the same objective of getting into better riding shape?

 

[Alex Simmons]

alex, just wondering. so much emphasis is put on quality, not quantity. it seems that for people with budgeted time, just going out for a ride with out a specific goal in mind doesn't really produce much results; maybe just geting the body prepared for long hours in the saddle. with that in mind, which ride would you say is more quality than quantity? or are they both quality, just different ways of getting to the same objective of getting into better riding shape?

Quality has little to do with quantity, a long ride can still be a high quality ride - it all depends on what you need to do to achieve the adaptations you seek (just like a short intense ride can be the wrong approach at times).

However, training at certain intensity/duration combinations can give you more bang for buck so to speak when building long term training loads focussed on improving Functional Threshold Power. Have a look at this item on sweet spot training:
http://www.pezcyclingnews.com/default.asp?pg=fullstory&id=3232
and hopefully you will see what I mean.