Unfaired recumbent hour record vs. upright



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John,

I respect your level of training within family and work constraints. And I do agree the vast
majority of recumbent riders are far beyond what typical Cat 1 and 2 racers can commit too.

OTOH, I think Fastboy is like the Pete Pennsayes of the Bent World with a "total commitment" to
training and serious riding as a priority. He is in my mind one of the rarer exceptions to the rule.

See you at our outing in a few months, it'll be great to share war stories and the comraiderie of
fellow riders!

Ed - it's about time we ride again, and on similar bikes! - Gin

John Foltz wrote:

> FasterthanUR wrote:
>
> > Apparetnly we have never met John...
> >
> No, I guess you haven't met me. Ed and a few others in the Chicagoland group have. I don't have
> any racing on my calendar for this year, but maybe I'll meet you at Stevens Point this summer.
> With your higher level of training, I will expect U to be *much* faster than IR.
> --
>
> John Foltz --- O _ Baron --- _O _ V-Rex 24/63 --- _\\/\-%)
> _________(_)`=()___________________(_)= (_)_____
 
Ed Gin & Shirleen Kajiwara wrote:
>
> Fastboy just defeated over 170 wedgie riders on faster NON UCI bikes with aero bars, trick wheels
> and framesets with one significant pull at 36.5 mph for many miles.

Given the social skills that have been displayed, my bet is that the 170 riders just let him off the
front so he'd go away! I remember doing that with a similar bent rider once.

Thank goodness you guys aren't typical.

--
Frank Krygowski [email protected]
 
In article <[email protected]>,
Frank Krygowski <[email protected]> wrote:

> Ed Gin & Shirleen Kajiwara wrote:
> >
> > Fastboy just defeated over 170 wedgie riders on faster NON UCI bikes with aero bars, trick
> > wheels and framesets with one significant pull at 36.5 mph for many miles.
>
> Given the social skills that have been displayed, my bet is that the 170 riders just let him off
> the front so he'd go away! I remember doing that with a similar bent rider once.
>
> Thank goodness you guys aren't typical.
>
> --
> Frank Krygowski [email protected]

Frank, There is a lot of arrogance displayed on my behalf in that thread due to the totally ignorant
posts started by my good pal Fab. I've heard all of that "get a real bike, can't climb, can't go
fast" **** many years now usually by weak smart ass CAT racers trying to prove something. I can come
up with as many offending posts as Fabby and anyone who suggests a bent is a joke bike.

The accomplished USCF & UMCA riders and racers I know have no problems with bents and are always
open to discuss the pros and cons of the diamond frame or bent platform. I actually have a lot of
respect for many diamond frame riders.

However if someone or a particular group want to trash talk the bent platform with total disrespect
and no background knowledge of bents in general I'll continue to make the same acid posts.

Best Regards, FastBoy
 
Frank,

The Matts TT series is pretty well respected amongst the Midwest racers.

And obviously you have no inkling of what time trialist strive to do.

Yes, we are not typical thank goodness. Thinking out of the box will do wonders.

Ed - you'll never get it and for the better - Gin

Frank Krygowski wrote:

> Ed Gin & Shirleen Kajiwara wrote:
> >
> > Fastboy just defeated over 170 wedgie riders on faster NON UCI bikes with aero bars, trick
> > wheels and framesets with one significant pull at 36.5 mph for many miles.
>
> Given the social skills that have been displayed, my bet is that the 170 riders just let him off
> the front so he'd go away! I remember doing that with a similar bent rider once.
>
> Thank goodness you guys aren't typical.
>
> --
> Frank Krygowski [email protected]
 
Yeah,

I am in total agreement with Fastboy, some of our best friends are "world record holders" of DF
events. We frequently ride on the same training circuits and have mutual respect and admiration.

Ed - not a hostile rider, nor have a chip on my shoulder - Gin

FasterthanUR wrote:

> In article <[email protected]>,
> Frank Krygowski <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > Ed Gin & Shirleen Kajiwara wrote:
> > >
> > > Fastboy just defeated over 170 wedgie riders on faster NON UCI bikes with aero bars, trick
> > > wheels and framesets with one significant pull at 36.5 mph for many miles.
> >
> > Given the social skills that have been displayed, my bet is that the 170 riders just let him off
> > the front so he'd go away! I remember doing that with a similar bent rider once.
> >
> > Thank goodness you guys aren't typical.
> >
> > --
> > Frank Krygowski [email protected]
>
> Frank, There is a lot of arrogance displayed on my behalf in that thread due to the totally
> ignorant posts started by my good pal Fab. I've heard all of that "get a real bike, can't climb,
> can't go fast" **** many years now usually by weak smart ass CAT racers trying to prove something.
> I can come up with as many offending posts as Fabby and anyone who suggests a bent is a joke bike.
>
> The accomplished USCF & UMCA riders and racers I know have no problems with bents and are always
> open to discuss the pros and cons of the diamond frame or bent platform. I actually have a lot of
> respect for many diamond frame riders.
>
> However if someone or a particular group want to trash talk the bent platform with total
> disrespect and no background knowledge of bents in general I'll continue to make the same
> acid posts.
>
> Best Regards, FastBoy
 
> Ed - not a hostile rider, nor have a chip on my shoulder - Gin

ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha
 
Ed Gin & Shirleen Kajiwara <[email protected]> wrote:

>I'm surprised you DF clowns are so ill informed about speed specific lowracers.

Not so, I've read the entire book titled "'Bents that can climb well". I've posted the entire
text below:

Mark Hickey Habanero Cycles http://www.habcycles.com Home of the $695 ti frame
 
Frank Krygowski wrote:
>
> Ed Gin & Shirleen Kajiwara wrote:
> >
> > Fastboy just defeated over 170 wedgie riders on faster NON UCI bikes with aero bars, trick
> > wheels and framesets with one significant pull at 36.5 mph for many miles.
>
> Given the social skills that have been displayed, my bet is that the 170 riders just let him off
> the front so he'd go away! I remember doing that with a similar bent rider once.
>
> Thank goodness you guys aren't typical.

Frank,

Through a few dropped hints on the "Recumbent vs. Traditional" thread, prior knowledge, and knowing
where to search on the web, I believe I have deduced FastBoy's true identity. (No one told me, and
no, I am not going to post my hypothesis.) With the author's identity in mind, FastBoy's posting
gain an additional level of humor.

I believe if you rode with Ed and FastBoy your opinion might be different. Actually, I personally
would not talk to FastBoy much while riding, since I am too out of shape to maintain a conversation
for long at his 22+ mph recreational riding pace.

Tom Sherman - Quad Cities USA (Illinois side)
 
In article <[email protected]>, Markey wrote:

> Not so, I've read the entire book titled "'Bents that can climb well". I've posted the entire
> text below:

Markey is just another chump like Fab who will get passed on any climb, any given day by a rider on
racing bent.

Hmmm, $695 ti junk frames for sale. I'll pass on that waste of money Mark.

Always FaterthanUR Mark, Your Good Pal, FastBoy
 
Moron Markie baby.....

You've been sharing that bottle of vaseline too much. Watch out the next time you play with your
willies while looking in the mirror at yourselves.

disease's).

Ed - keep your vaseline to yourselves - Gin

FasterthanUR wrote:

> In article <[email protected]>, Markey wrote:
>
> > Not so, I've read the entire book titled "'Bents that can climb well". I've posted the entire
> > text below:
>
> Markey is just another chump like Fab who will get passed on any climb, any given day by a rider
> on racing bent.
>
> Hmmm, $695 ti junk frames for sale. I'll pass on that waste of money Mark.
>
> Always FaterthanUR Mark, Your Good Pal, FastBoy
 
"FasterthanUR" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:FasterthanUR->
> Markey is just another chump like Fab who will get passed on any climb, any given day by a rider
> on racing bent.
>

Right....a dork laying on a hammock and pedalling with his feet above his head is even going to be
anywhere near a hill!

I'm out on the bike all the time and I know you oddballs on bents never go anywhere near the hills.

I'm willing to leave you kooks alone, just don't expect to get any respect from a serious roadie
like me, that's just not going to happen.
 
Girlyman Fab writes: I'm willing to leave you kooks alone, just don't expect to
> get any respect from a serious roadie like me, that's just not going to happen.
>
>
Fabby Baby, Go out and spin your tiny 53T gears. You little girlyman who doesn't know squat
about cycling.

Always FasterthanUR,

Fastboy
 
FasterthanUR <[email protected]> wrote:

>In article <[email protected]>, Markey wrote:
>
>> Not so, I've read the entire book titled "'Bents that can climb well". I've posted the entire
>> text below:
>
>Markey is just another chump like Fab who will get passed on any climb, any given day by a rider on
>racing bent.
>
>Hmmm, $695 ti junk frames for sale. I'll pass on that waste of money Mark.
>
>Always FaterthanUR Mark, Your Good Pal, FastBoy

You guys aren't even good trolls. Sit back, watch how Fab does it and come back when you think you
can at least be original or entertaining. You've got a long, long way to go.

Oh here's another short book for you... Bents I've seen riding trails in Arizona.

Mark Hickey Habanero Cycles http://www.habcycles.com Home of the $695 ti frame
 
"Ed Gin & Shirleen Kajiwara" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Moron Markie baby.....
>
> You've been sharing that bottle of vaseline too much. Watch out the next time you play with your
> willies while looking in the mirror at yourselves.
>

> disease's).
>
> Ed - keep your vaseline to yourselves - Gin

Ed,

At least "FastBoy" has the decency to keep his insults to a person's bike or riding ability. What is
this facination of yours with masturbation? No one

write disparaging remarks about them. Rare is the poster around here that doesn't try to keep it
clean. We have young readers who don't need to see this kind of writing. It is especially poor
taste. This is the kind of thing that will land you in most people's killfile. You want to insult
people, fine. But keep it clean.

-Buck
 
Ed Gin & Shirleen Kajiwara <[email protected]> wrote:

>Moron Markie baby.....
>
>You've been sharing that bottle of vaseline too much. Watch out the next time you play with your
>willies while looking in the mirror at yourselves.
>

>disease's).
>
>Ed - keep your vaseline to yourselves - Gin
>
>FasterthanUR wrote:
>
>> In article <[email protected]>, Markey wrote:
>>
>> > Not so, I've read the entire book titled "'Bents that can climb well". I've posted the entire
>> > text below:
>>
>> Markey is just another chump like Fab who will get passed on any climb, any given day by a rider
>> on racing bent.
>>
>> Hmmm, $695 ti junk frames for sale. I'll pass on that waste of money Mark.
>>
>> Always FaterthanUR Mark, Your Good Pal, FastBoy

Yawn.

Mark Hickey Habanero Cycles http://www.habcycles.com Home of the $695 ti frame
 
In article <[email protected]>,
"Buck" <j u n k m a i l @ g a l a x y c o r p . c o m> wrote:

>
> At least "FastBoy" has the decency to keep his insults to a person's bike or riding ability.

Buck, All this stuff has gotten a bit old and out of hand. I'm starting to get bored with the role
of Fastboy in these threads.

Too bad we just can't discuss the pros and cons of aerodynamics on both the bent and DF platform
with no biases. There are plusses and minus no matter what the frame design is. I know that you ride
in terrain that requires a lot of versatility and what you are currently riding is the best for the
area you are in. Personally, I have no problems with what you are riding as it keep you in shape and
enjoying the experience.

The bents that Ed and I ride are European imports that were designed for racing and also to be
ridden on the street. The average bike shop will not have any knowledge about our bikes. The fact is
the Europeans have been designing recumbents for many many years now and have advanced the
efficiency of the design to a higher level than what is being produced regarding production bents in
the US. There is only one builder in the US at this point in time producing a speed specific
lowracer as opposed to the European recumbent builders. Most of the bents sold in the US are used
for touring and not racing.

The common impression most roadies have is that bents are slow, can't climb, etc.. and not all of
that is true. What they are witnessing is most likely a rider on a 35+ lb. touring bent

The amount of riders in the US that own and ride racing bents is quite small so the exposure is very
limited. The guys that are riding race specific bents are very fast. We hear the same old rehashed
digs like fat old guys ride bents, those things are not real bikes and all the other **** constantly
being posted on bike forums.

If you guys who own DFs would just accept the fact that there are performance oriented bents that
are as fast and sometimes faster than diamond frames, that performance bents can climb
efficiently and are also safe on the road then we would probably get along better and the acid
posts would vanish.

Bents are a different platform than DF's. Some of us bent riders are using fairings to benefit
efficiency and there are other bent riders who build their own custom bikes for racing and those are
extremely low to the ground and other's are fully faired.

If this thread ever becomes civil I'll be glad to share a lot of info with you and whoever else is
interested. But if I have to continually listen to my pal Fab and others with their degrading
opinions regarding speed specific performance bents and bents in general then no one here will learn
anything regarding efficiency or speed when riding.

Shall we continue this discussion Buck?

FastBoy
 
In article <[email protected]>, Mark Hickey <[email protected]> wrote:

Sit back, watch how Fab does it

Mark, I could care less what Fab does.

I've rode the mountains in AZ and NM on a PACtour. I've been there and they were tough to climb with
a loaded 35+ lb bent. It would be a different scenario on the lightweight bent I'm now riding.

You are very fortunate to live out there with the great roads, good weather and beautiful
environment.

Regards, FastBoy
 
"FasterthanUR" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:FasterthanUR-
> >
> > At least "FastBoy" has the decency to keep his insults to a person's
bike or
> > riding ability.
>
> Buck, All this stuff has gotten a bit old and out of hand. I'm starting to get bored with the role
> of Fastboy in these threads.

I'm glad to see that you are ready to have a discussion in a civil manner. You will find that the
vast majority of the posters around here like to discuss the issues, debunk the myths and have a
good-hearted exhange of ideas. As I relayed to you via private e-mail, Fabrizio is the one poseur
around here who typifies the posters over in rec.bicycles.racing. Take whatever he writes with a big
grain of salt. Get a good laugh out of it and move on.

> Too bad we just can't discuss the pros and cons of aerodynamics on both the bent and DF platform
> with no biases. There are plusses and minus no matter what the frame design is. I know that you
> ride in terrain that requires a lot of versatility and what you are currently riding is the best
> for the area you are in. Personally, I have no problems with what you are riding as it keep you in
> shape and enjoying the experience.

Now this is the kind of discussion that we are most interested in! There are several 'bents I
would like to try out on a long-term basis when my budget (and space) constraints ease up a bit.
I've had my eye on a Greenspeed trike, but can't justify the expense if I can't use it on my daily
commute. As it is now, I rotate through four different bikes, all of which handle the commute
well. Two are road, two are mountain. One of the mountain bikes is full suspension, but once was
my everyday commuter with slicks, my weekend trail bomber with knobbies. The second has become a
rainy-day bike with full theft deterrence (rusty paint scratches), full fenders, a rear rack, and
mounts for lights.

I would "need" two bents if I were to try them out - a weekday commuter and a weekend racer. Not for
racing, mind you, but I like going fast for the thrill. Whether or not it would be faster is part
and parcel to the discussion, but being just a few inches off the ground is certain to make the
perceived speeds much higher.

> The bents that Ed and I ride are European imports that were designed for racing and also to be
> ridden on the street. The average bike shop will not have any knowledge about our bikes. The fact
> is the Europeans have been designing recumbents for many many years now and have advanced the
> efficiency of the design to a higher level than what is being produced regarding production bents
> in the US. There is only one builder in the US at this point in time producing a speed specific
> lowracer as opposed to the European recumbent builders. Most of the bents sold in the US are used
> for touring and not racing.

I've seen a number of the websites, but admit to seeing very few in person. I do have a
'bent-specific shop nearby, so I have access to a large number of 'bents and even have ridden most
of their stock. But comfort is their thing, so lowracers aren't in their business plan.

> The common impression most roadies have is that bents are slow, can't climb, etc.. and not all of
> that is true. What they are witnessing is most likely a rider on a 35+ lb. touring bent

While I can agree that most people's experience is with a limited range of 'bents, I still wonder
about the physiology of climbing while on a 'bent. There is just something unnatural about the foot
position relative to the body when going uphill on a 'bent. This is where people like Jon and I
start throwing science at the question. We would test the climbing ability through a series of
all-out efforts up a nice big hill and time the runs. I'd also like to physiological data during the
rides. I'm guessing that blood pressure would be higher while climbing on the 'bent because of the
body position. I would also bet that their respiration and heart rates would be lower. Since you
have a 'bent (and probably a diamond frame too), you could run these tests yourself and get back to
us with the results. Heck, I'm sure that we would be satisfied with a few well-timed sprints up your
favorite hill switching back and forth between bikes between each run.

> The amount of riders in the US that own and ride racing bents is quite small so the exposure is
> very limited. The guys that are riding race specific bents are very fast. We hear the same old
> rehashed digs like fat old guys ride bents, those things are not real bikes and all the other ****
> constantly being posted on bike forums.

I'm sure that there is plenty being dished out to you, but the only way to gain respect around here
is to post some hard data, not use slash and burn tactics with the other posters. I have to admit,
before this post, you were just about to be "plonked" into my killfile. If you want to get some
folks here excited about trying out a lowracer, then show us the data. We have a large number of
people in here that own a garage full of bikes and I'm sure a zippy little lowracer would find a
good home among them if you can convince us that they are worth the big bundle of cash!

> If you guys who own DFs would just accept the fact that there are performance oriented bents that
> are as fast and sometimes faster than diamond frames, that performance bents can climb
> efficiently and are also safe on the road then we would probably get along better and the acid
> posts would vanish.

No one here argues that lowracers are faster on the flats and downhill. Many of us have experienced
this first hand as one passed us by. But most of us know being passed is no big deal, since
experience has shown us that we will catch and pass that guy on the next big hill. It's just our
experience. Safety and climbing efficiency are oft-discussed around here. Personally, I think some
'bents would make safe commuting machines. But it depends on where they are ridden and what 'bent we
are talking about. Being lower than the passenger window cannot be a good thing.

> Bents are a different platform than DF's. Some of us bent riders are using fairings to benefit
> efficiency and there are other bent riders who build their own custom bikes for racing and those
> are extremely low to the ground and other's are fully faired.
>
> If this thread ever becomes civil I'll be glad to share a lot of info with you and whoever else is
> interested. But if I have to continually listen to my pal Fab and others with their degrading
> opinions regarding speed specific performance bents and bents in general then no one here will
> learn anything regarding efficiency or speed when riding.

Provide us with some objective information and you will find that we will share as well. If you are
willing to carry out some experiments with your machine, the data will be well-received. If you
aren't comfortable with setting up an objective experiment, we will be glad to make suggestions.
Post some results along with your opinion about why you think they came out that way and you will
garner a lot of respect here!

> Shall we continue this discussion Buck?

I'm willing as are others. Let's see what we can all learn from each other.

-Buck

P.S., If you have a name that we could address other than "FastBoy," that might help with the
civility. We all respect anonymity if you want to stay that way, but the name you have chosen
can put readers on the defensive. Sort of like Fabrizio does to you. Many post with their real
names, some post with their first names and a few remain anonymous.
 
Yeah,

Fab, the resident troll has just been added to my kill file.

Good bye! Your antics are directed to la la land, as is any more "PG" material........sorry guys for
my offensive posts to this fictitious character......

Ed Gin

Fabrizio Mazzoleni wrote:

> "FasterthanUR" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:FasterthanUR->
> > Markey is just another chump like Fab who will get passed on any climb, any given day by a rider
> > on racing bent.
> >
>
> Right....a dork laying on a hammock and pedalling with his feet above his head is even going to be
> anywhere near a hill!
>
> I'm out on the bike all the time and I know you oddballs on bents never go anywhere near
> the hills.
>
> I'm willing to leave you kooks alone, just don't expect to get any respect from a serious roadie
> like me, that's just not going to happen.
 
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