vitamin s said:
What are signs of clean riding? You mentioned that in regard to Lemond having a bad day. So are you saying that a cyclist has a bad day they are clean?
Jeez what is Lemond's hard on!
- Thread starter hpearson
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What are signs of clean riding? You mentioned that in regard to Lemond having a bad day. So are you saying that a cyclist has a bad day they are clean?
naw, im saying that pre-epo, tour de france winners rountinely had 1 or more bad days at some point over the course of 3 weeks. hinault, roche, lemond....minus the two known dopers. post-epo, the tour champs rarely broke down and could follow any attack. im not saying that the 80's were full of clean riders. but the stuff they were on wasnt anything like the stuff the guys are on now. delgado probably roided his way to the win in 88 and rooks and winnen admitted doping at that time.....the list goes on, but i tend to believe that the way the tour was ridden back then was a lot cleaner than it is now.
vitamin s said:
Roche was found guilty of using epo towards the end of his career. Delgado was positive for probenicid (a known steroid masking agent) - it was on the IOC list but was due on the UCI list at the end of July 88 - days after he was busted. Steven rooks at his hippy looking team mate were both busted for dope. Sean Kelly was busted several times - once for using his mechanics p1ss... But didn't ask his mechanic if he was taking speed first. Kelly was also involved inthe intralipid (let's not beat about the bush - epo affair). Fignon doped. LeMond came back from a dead looking career mid 89 to ride the best time trial in Tour history and went on to make Fignon look like a slow poke on the big hill on the final lap of the worlds.
The US Olympic team blood doped en masse for the 84 olympics in LA. LA and blood doping in a hotel... Irony? Moser blood doped... So did the Italians. Apparently the east Germans and Russians were doing it before that.
The 80s... Yeah. Positively virginal.
Now can y'all collectively pull your heads out of either the sand or your as$es and stop thinking that it was just the 90s and onwards that were bad because if you do the you're about 10 years too late to the blood doping game...
no disputing your claims. carl lewis in 84 made riis look like a small timer. fignon also guilty of amphetamines after his impressive 89 ride. the 80's were probably a high point in athletics for steroid use. flojo, jackie joyner kersey, the east germans, etc.
in my original post i wrote that lemond showed signs of clean riding during the 89 tour. im saying that the possibilities of him winning the 89 tour clean are plausible. he did a good time trial in the giro that year and so it wasnt completely out of nowhere. i think that it was possible to win a tour in the 80's clean. i dont think its possible now.
in my original post i wrote that lemond showed signs of clean riding during the 89 tour. im saying that the possibilities of him winning the 89 tour clean are plausible. he did a good time trial in the giro that year and so it wasnt completely out of nowhere. i think that it was possible to win a tour in the 80's clean. i dont think its possible now.
vitamin s said:
Where was LeMond during the first two weeks of the Giro? Up sh1t creak without a paddle. Three iron shots in the butt cheeks from his trusty trainer, some B12 and the world was his... In an instant.
You don't fix anemia that fast even if you're in bed resting, let alone riding yourself into the ground on a three week Grand Tour.
When Armstrong cracked on the joux-plane, was that the sign of riding clean or just bonking? When Armstrong failed in the big time trial in 2003 was that due to clean riding or heat issues? Oh, he had a bad day... He can't be spinning blood on the team bus!
:smacksheadintobrickwall
What I'm most gobsmacked about is the last stage of the '89 Tour where LeMond made up 58 seconds on Laurent Fignon (confessed doper) in the ITT, ultimately winning the race by 8 seconds.
He beat Fignon & all the rest that were honked to the gills, riding clean. Give over. I don't care what your VO2 max is, drugs can turn a rider into a demon.
He beat Fignon & all the rest that were honked to the gills, riding clean. Give over. I don't care what your VO2 max is, drugs can turn a rider into a demon.
You mean that Lemond rode clean? Prove it. Just because only Floyd Landis was caught riding dirty doesn't mean the rest of the peloton was clean, that's a crazy and ignorant assumption.
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