New bus lane threat

Discussion in 'UK and Europe' started by Tony W, Feb 14, 2003.

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  1. Tony W

    Tony W Guest

    We are, apparently, going to get fancy new bus lanes with traffic lights that know when a bus or a
    taxi with the right bit of electronics is approaching.

    When asked 'what about cyclists' there were a few shrugs, some scratching of bollox and an 'oh,
    we're studying that' (i.e. oh f*ck, forgot about them).

    Are there suitable solutions in other parts of the world/country?

    T
     
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  2. Tony W wrote:
    > We are, apparently, going to get fancy new bus lanes with traffic lights that know when a bus or a
    > taxi with the right bit of electronics is approaching.
    >
    > When asked 'what about cyclists' there were a few shrugs, some scratching of bollox and an 'oh,
    > we're studying that' (i.e. oh f*ck, forgot about them).
    >
    > Are there suitable solutions in other parts of the world/country?

    There are a couple of these in Oxford on Botley Road. At the junction near Seacourt Towers the
    cyclist (in the bus/cycle lane) pushes a button which tells the lights of the cyclists existence.

    The one further towards town didn't have a button as at that point cyclists are assumed to be on the
    shared pavement which goes around the light and drops onto an onroad cycle lane (the bus lane
    disappears at the lights.) When I used to use these lights (from the bus lane) I would either join
    the normal lane if possible and go through with the cars or I'd run up onto the pavement (plenty of
    lowered kerbs) and then drop back into the cycle lane after the lights. Of course I occasionally
    went straight through with a bus, if lucky.

    Colin
     
  3. "Tony W" <[email protected]> wrote: ( We are, apparently, going to get fancy new bus lanes
    with traffic lights ) that know when a bus or a taxi with the right bit of electronics is (
    approaching. ) ( When asked 'what about cyclists' there were a few shrugs, some scratching of )
    bollox and an 'oh, we're studying that' (i.e. oh f*ck, forgot about them). ( ) Are there suitable
    solutions in other parts of the world/country?

    A common solution is a push-button unit, like the pedestrians' push-button at a pelican, but mounted
    on a lower post and facing into the bus-and-cycle lane.

    We have them in Oxford and they are tolerable.
     
  4. People out there who come to the CTC York Rally might be familiar with one of York's Bus Priority
    schemes on The Mount just before the junction with Holgate Road, city-bound. The cycle lane to the
    left of the bus lane simply doesn't have a stop line where the bus priority lights are. So cyclists
    can proceed in the cycle lane whether the lights are green for the bus/taxi priority lane or green
    for the general traffic lane.

    You can get hostility on occasion as it looks like you're simply sailing through a red light -
    cyclists who haven't seen this set up will often stop at the lights too. Generally works very well
    in practice, with the usual provisos about the dangers of passing large vehicles, such as buses,
    on the left.

    I think this is preferable to a cycle sensitive switching system because it avoids
    unnecessary stops.
    --
    Paul
     
  5. David Hansen

    David Hansen Guest

    On Fri, 14 Feb 2003 05:21:25 -0000 someone who may be "Tony W" <[email protected]>
    wrote this:-

    >Are there suitable solutions in other parts of the world/country?

    Traffic lights with four bulb units. When the main green signal is not lit the green cycle
    unit is lit.

    --
    David Hansen, Edinburgh | PGP email preferred-key number F566DA0E I will always explain revoked
    keys, unless the UK government prevents me using the RIP Act 2000.
     
  6. Pattledom

    Pattledom Guest

    Tony W wrote:
    > We are, apparently, going to get fancy new bus lanes with traffic lights that know when a bus or a
    > taxi with the right bit of electronics is approaching.
    >
    > When asked 'what about cyclists' there were a few shrugs, some scratching of bollox and an 'oh,
    > we're studying that' (i.e. oh f*ck, forgot about them).
    >
    > Are there suitable solutions in other parts of the world/country?
    >

    Ipswich has some lanes like that... there is a seperate detector for cycles but it's close to the
    stop line so you invariably have to stop and wait[1]. Oddly, when I was riding a Kirk, it would
    never trigger the lights in Ipswich's bus lanes but my current steel-framed commuting bike works
    them OK. The Kirk worked normal lights so I can only assume that these cycle detectors are tuned in
    some way to only respond to a "typical" bicycle - thus preventing a car in the bus lane from
    chcnaging the lights.

    Where the lights only control the merging of the bus lane and the other line, with no other
    conflicting movements, I think a better solution is to have a cycle filter light on the bus lane.
    Ipswich hasn't done this but I've seen it done in Cambridge.

    [1] well, unless you can find a handy bus to follow.

    --
    Andrew Pattle
     
  7. Paul Oter

    Paul Oter Guest

    "Tony W" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > We are, apparently, going to get fancy new bus lanes with traffic lights that know when a bus or a
    > taxi with the right bit of electronics is approaching.
    >
    > When asked 'what about cyclists' there were a few shrugs, some scratching
    of
    > bollox and an 'oh, we're studying that' (i.e. oh f*ck, forgot about them).
    >
    > Are there suitable solutions in other parts of the world/country?
    >

    Yes, very much yes. Here in Cambridge we have six locations with traffic signals at the end of bus
    lanes, triggered by transponder devices carried by buses. In four of these locations there isn't a
    junction - the lights are purely to stop the cars and let the buses jump the queue.

    At five of these locations a green cycle filter light, which is *permanently on* exempts cyclists
    from having to stop.

    http://www.camcycle.org.uk/newsletters/17/article17.html describes a location where bus signals were
    installed at the end of a bus lane, and Cambridge Cycling Campaign were lobbying to get a cycle
    filter installed.

    http://www.camcycle.org.uk/newsletters/20/article19.html was written a few months later, and shows
    that this campaign was successful. It also shows a photo of what a cycle filter looks like.

    http://www.camcycle.org.uk/newsletters/35/article20.html (scroll down to the bottom) describes a
    different location (further along the same road) where a permanent cycle filter was installed to
    exempt cyclists from signals at the end of a bus lane - even when traffic is emerging from a side
    road on the right.

    PaulO
     
  8. "Paul Oter" <[email protected]> wrote: (
    http://www.camcycle.org.uk/newsletters/35/article20.html (scroll down to ) the bottom) describes a
    different location (further along the same road) ( where a permanent cycle filter was installed to
    exempt cyclists from signals ) at the end of a bus lane - even when traffic is emerging from a side
    road on ( the right.

    I presume that the bit that says

    > The idea is that cyclists using the junction are protected from turning traffic by the cycle lane
    > that runs through the junction.

    assumes that there are no cycles in the turning traffic.

    The place I most frequently come into conflict with other cyclists when those cyclists have
    (illegally) run a red light is when I am turning right with motor traffic at a particular such
    junction (with no filter) and the greenhouse behind me forces me into the mandatory cycle lane that
    they are already occupying.
     
  9. Tony W

    Tony W Guest

    "Paul Oter" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    >
    > Yes, very much yes. Here in Cambridge we have six locations with traffic signals at the end of bus
    > lanes, triggered by transponder devices carried
    by
    > buses. In four of these locations there isn't a junction - the lights are purely to stop the cars
    > and let the buses jump the queue.
    >
    > At five of these locations a green cycle filter light, which is
    *permanently
    > on* exempts cyclists from having to stop.

    Thanks -- not sure that would work at a cross roads but, as we all know, traffic lights don't apply
    to cyclists anyway :eek:

    T
     
  10. "Paul Oter" <[email protected]> writes:
    > "Tony W" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > news:[email protected]...
    > > We are, apparently, going to get fancy new bus lanes with traffic lights that know when a bus or
    > > a taxi with the right bit of electronics is approaching.
    > >
    > > When asked 'what about cyclists' there were a few shrugs, some scratching
    > of
    > > bollox and an 'oh, we're studying that' (i.e. oh f*ck, forgot about them).
    > >
    > > Are there suitable solutions in other parts of the world/country?
    > >
    >
    > Yes, very much yes. Here in Cambridge we have six locations with traffic signals at the end of bus
    > lanes, triggered by transponder devices carried by buses. In four of these locations there isn't a
    > junction - the lights are purely to stop the cars and let the buses jump the queue.
    >
    > At five of these locations a green cycle filter light, which is *permanently on* exempts cyclists
    > from having to stop.
    >
    > http://www.camcycle.org.uk/newsletters/17/article17.html describes a location where bus signals
    > were installed at the end of a bus lane, and Cambridge Cycling Campaign were lobbying to get a
    > cycle filter installed.
    >
    > http://www.camcycle.org.uk/newsletters/20/article19.html was written a few months later, and shows
    > that this campaign was successful.

    Apart from "But not all such good news: still the lights at Ditton Lane don't detect bikes", which
    is still true over four years later, so cyclists have the choices of swing back out of the bus/cycle
    lane, detour up onto the (shared use, so legal) pavement, or just go straight through the red light.

    Are there any plans to _ever_ fix it? (Personally I think a permanent filter that allowed bikes
    through in the left lane even when the right lane was stopped to allow traffic to turn right from
    Ditton Lane would be safe.)
     
  11. Tony Finch

    Tony Finch Guest

    Alan Braggins <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    >Apart from "But not all such good news: still the lights at Ditton Lane don't detect bikes", which
    >is still true over four years later, so cyclists have the choices of swing back out of the
    >bus/cycle lane, detour up onto the (shared use, so legal) pavement, or just go straight through the
    >red light.

    Have you tried emailing [email protected] or [email protected]
    ? It worked for me last time I had such a complaint.

    Tony.
    --
    f.a.n.finch <[email protected]> http://dotat.at/ CAPE WRATH TO RATTRAY HEAD INCLUDING ORKNEY: SOUTHEAST 5
    TO 7, PERHAPS GALE 8 AROUND ORKNEY. FAIR START, PERHAPS PATCHY RAIN OR SLEET LATER. MODERATE
    OR GOOD. MODERATE WHERE SHELTERED, OTHERWISE ROUGH, PERHAPS VERY ROUGH.
     
  12. Alan Braggins <[email protected]> enlightened us with: [traffic lights at Newmarket
    Road/Ditton Lane detecting cyclists]
    >Are there any plans to _ever_ fix it? (Personally I think a permanent filter that allowed bikes
    >through in the left lane even when the right lane was stopped to allow traffic to turn right from
    >Ditton Lane would be safe.)

    Safe-ish. That junction is quite a black spot, from the frequent appearance of broken glass. Drivers
    don't pay much attention to their road positioning unfortunately, and many try to race against the
    person on the other lane to reach the left hand lane of Barnwell Road roundabout first to go round
    the ring road. I don't think we could trust them enough to pay attention, particularly since they're
    swinging round a 90 degree bend on the outside so the nose positioning has to be just right, and
    thereafter the lanes are only just wide enough for cyclists.

    But that's not to say it shouldn't be done.... but I think some of the grassy verge might have to go
    to allow it, and put up a separating kerb or something instead.

    Jifl (who goes through that junction every time he cycles pretty much anywhere)
    --
    --[ "You can complain because roses have thorns, or you ]-- --[ can rejoice because thorns have
    roses." -Lincoln ]-- Opinions==mine
     
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