S&S couplers on a recumbent

[Dan Burkhart]

Has anyone ever tried installing S&S couplers in a recumbent. I have a Quetzal C105 with a 2" single tube frame. S&S makes a 2" unit, and I would like to try it, but I would be interested to know if it has been tried and what the results were
Dan Burkhart
Oakville Ont

 

[Jay]

>Dan Burkhart at [email protected] wrote: Has anyone ever tried installing S&S couplers
>in a recumbent. I have a Quetzal C105 with a 2" single tube frame. S&S makes a 2" unit, and I would
>like to try it, but I would be interested to know if it has been tried and what the results were
>Dan Burkhart Oakville Ont

S&S Couplers are only sold to certified frame builders. Various manufacturers of bents have them
including Greenspeed and Burley

There are threads about this subject on the Framebuilders list at Phred.

 

[Jeff Wills]

Dan Burkhart <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> Has anyone ever tried installing S&S couplers in a recumbent. I have a Quetzal C105 with a 2"
> single tube frame. S&S makes a 2" unit, and I would like to try it, but I would be interested to
> know if it has been tried and what the results were Dan Burkhart Oakville Ont
>

S&S couplers can only be installed by approved framebuilders:
http://www.sandsmachine.com/fbplist.htm but S&S specifically excludes monotube bikes.

Jeff

 

[Freewheeling]

On Fri, 16 Jan 2004 18:15:26 -0400, Jay <[email protected]> wrote:

>S&S Couplers are only sold to certified frame builders. Various manufacturers of bents have them
>including Greenspeed and Burley
>
>There are threads about this subject on the Framebuilders list at Phred.

My nephew is a framebuilder. I've been thinking about having him "chop" my V-Rex. I'll bet he'll
give me a better deal, and finish the work in far shorter time, than Bilenky.

http://www.demosophia.com

 

[John Riley]

S&S couplers are commonly used in recumbents, but I think you will find on their website that they
are not recommended for monotubes. They may come loose.

Also the couplers may cost more than the bike.

Dan Burkhart <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:<[email protected]>...
> Has anyone ever tried installing S&S couplers in a recumbent. I have a Quetzal C105 with a 2"
> single tube frame. S&S makes a 2" unit, and I would like to try it, but I would be interested to
> know if it has been tried and what the results were Dan Burkhart Oakville Ont
>
>
>
> --

 

[John Riley]

Also: noticed that you are in Oakville. I am in Toronto. I would sell you a Rans Wave that has a
hinge in it for less than installed couplers would cost.

If you are interested, contact me at johnriley1 (at) rogers (dot) com

 

[Cletus D . Lee]

In article <[email protected]>, usenet- [email protected] says...
> Has anyone ever tried installing S&S couplers in a recumbent. I have a Quetzal C105 with a 2"
> single tube frame. S&S makes a 2" unit, and I would like to try it, but I would be interested to
> know if it has been tried and what the results were Dan Burkhart Oakville Ont
>
I think S&S couplers can only work on triangulated frames. That is why you will only find them on
bikes like the RANS Screamer, V-Rex and my Lightning Voyager. I am not sure if the joint between the
coupler and the frame tube can handle the stresses induced on a monotube.

--
Cletus D. Lee Bacchetta Giro Lightning Voyager http://www.clee.org
- Bellaire, TX USA -

 

[Jay]

>> Has anyone ever tried installing S&S couplers in a recumbent. I have a Quetzal C105 with a 2"
>> single tube frame. S&S makes a 2" unit, and I would like to try it, but I would be interested to
>> know if it has been tried and what the results were Dan Burkhart Oakville Ont

>Cletus D. Lee at [email protected] wrote on 1/16/04 9:50 PM: I think S&S couplers can only work on
>triangulated frames. That is why you will only find them on bikes like the RANS Screamer, V-Rex and
>my Lightning Voyager. I am not sure if the joint between the coupler and the frame tube can handle
>the stresses induced on a monotube.

Actually they are used on the main tube of some Greenspeed trikes. http://www.greenspeed.com.au

 

[Tom Sherman]

Freewheeling wrote:

> My nephew is a framebuilder. I've been thinking about having him "chop" my V-Rex. I'll bet he'll
> give me a better deal, and finish the work in far shorter time, than Bilenky.

You could have him replace the rear dropouts with fork ends, so you could eliminate the Rohloff
chain tensioner.

Tom Sherman - Quad Cities

 

[Cletus D . Lee]

In article <BC2E0563.29BB2%[email protected]>, [email protected] says...
> >> Has anyone ever tried installing S&S couplers in a recumbent. I have a Quetzal C105 with a 2"
> >> single tube frame. S&S makes a 2" unit, and I would like to try it, but I would be interested
> >> to know if it has been tried and what the results were Dan Burkhart Oakville Ont
>
> >Cletus D. Lee at [email protected] wrote on 1/16/04 9:50 PM: I think S&S couplers can only work on
> >triangulated frames. That is why you will only find them on bikes like the RANS Screamer, V-Rex
> >and my Lightning Voyager. I am not sure if the joint between the coupler and the frame tube can
> >handle the stresses induced on a monotube.
>
> Actually they are used on the main tube of some Greenspeed trikes. http://www.greenspeed.com.au

I think if you look closely, you will find the S&S couplings are in the triangulated areas of
both the tandem and the single (the triangle formed between the rear seat stays, the seat frame
and the monotube)

--
Cletus D. Lee Bacchetta Giro Lightning Voyager http://www.clee.org
- Bellaire, TX USA -

 

[Tom]

Dan Burkhart <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> Has anyone ever tried installing S&S couplers in a recumbent. I have a Quetzal C105 with a 2"
> single tube frame. S&S makes a 2" unit, and I would like to try it, but I would be interested to
> know if it has been tried and what the results were Dan Burkhart Oakville Ont
>
>
>
> --

Hi,

Suggest you talk to Luke at Calhoun Cycles in Mpls,Minnesota.(calhouncycle.com)

I beleive he has some experience with S&S Couplers.

Tom H

 

[Cletus D . Lee]

In article <BC2E0563.29BB2%[email protected]>, [email protected] says...
> >> Has anyone ever tried installing S&S couplers in a recumbent. I have a Quetzal C105 with a 2"
> >> single tube frame. S&S makes a 2" unit, and I would like to try it, but I would be interested
> >> to know if it has been tried and what the results were Dan Burkhart Oakville Ont
>
> >Cletus D. Lee at [email protected] wrote on 1/16/04 9:50 PM: I think S&S couplers can only work on
> >triangulated frames. That is why you will only find them on bikes like the RANS Screamer, V-Rex
> >and my Lightning Voyager. I am not sure if the joint between the coupler and the frame tube can
> >handle the stresses induced on a monotube.

As for Burley, I believe that they only put S&S Couplings on their DF Bikes. I see no reference to
S&S on their website. Although I know I have seen S&S Coupled Burley Tandems.
--
Cletus D. Lee Bacchetta Giro Lightning Voyager http://www.clee.org
- Bellaire, TX USA -

 

[Tom Sherman]

Jay wrote:

> Actually they are used on the main tube of some Greenspeed trikes. http://www.greenspeed.com.au

But the seat on a Greenspeed trike is rigidly attached to the frame fore and aft of the coupler so
there would not the same magnitude of torsional loading on the coupler of a Greenspeed, as there
would be on a monotube frame single-track recumbent.

Tom Sherman - Quad Cities

 

[Jay]

>>> Cletus D. Lee at [email protected] wrote on 1/16/04 9:50 PM: I think S&S couplers can only work
>>> on triangulated frames. That is why you will only find them on bikes like the RANS Screamer, V-
>>> Rex and my Lightning Voyager. I am not sure if the joint between the coupler and the frame tube
>>> can handle the stresses induced on a monotube.
>>
>> Actually they are used on the main tube of some Greenspeed trikes. http://www.greenspeed.com.au

> Cletus D. Lee at [email protected] wrote I think if you look closely, you will find the S&S
> couplings are in the triangulated areas of both the tandem and the single (the triangle formed
> between the rear seat stays, the seat frame and the monotube)

Actually- I have one in my living room (rode for 16mths) and I was at the Greenspeed factory to see
about 40 trikes. The S&S is located on the main tube about 6 in in FRONT of the rear stays. The seat
frame sits ABOVE and INFRONT of the coupler so it can de-couple. We are both correct, there is
triangulation using the seat- the main S&S is on the main tube.
http://greenspeed.com.au/GTOSS768.jpg

 

[Freewheeling]

On Fri, 16 Jan 2004 20:43:07 -0600, Tom Sherman
<[email protected]> wrote:

>You could have him replace the rear dropouts with fork ends, so you could eliminate the Rohloff
>chain tensioner.

Oh yeah, that too. Have to check to make sure he's still certified though. He's apparently on a big
"back to nature" kick, living in the woods or something.

http://www.demosophia.com

 

[Mark Stonich]

[email protected] (tom) wrote in message
> > Has anyone ever tried installing S&S couplers in a recumbent. I have a Quetzal C105 with a 2"
> > single tube frame. S&S makes a 2" unit, and I would like to try it, but I would be interested to
> > know if it has been tried and what the results were Dan Burkhart Oakville Ont

> Suggest you talk to Luke at Calhoun Cycles in Mpls,Minnesota.(calhouncycle.com)
>
> I beleive he has some experience with S&S Couplers. Tom H

Calhoun only has them installed in bikes with triangulated frames. Just Rockets and Screamers so
far. The initial plan was for me to install them. But then Curt Goodrich, who has installed hundreds
of them, moved back to this area.

Curt is the best frame builder you never heard of. He's worked in some of the biggest name frame
shops and currently builds Rivendell frames. Currently, Luke has a converted Rocket, powdercoated a
georgeous blue, and a coupled Screamer.

Before deciding on S&S, Luke had me do a proto with couplers I made.
http://mnhpva.org/MNbikes/Rocket.html More work, but saved the cost of the S&S couplers.
Structurally I prefer my method, but the S&S are better looking and a known quantity, and therefore
easy to sell.

Dan, If you want to try to clone the upper clamp, for your Quetzal, the outer tube is 2.125" 4130
and the inner sleeve is 2" x 0.250 6061 turned down on a lathe to 0.0005" less than the ID of the
main tube. Don't thrust the nominal ID of the tube, cut the frame and measure the ID in 4 directions
and average the measurements. Tubes aren't all that round. Long pinch bolts were made from 1/2" cold
rolled 1018.

 

[Dan Burkhart]

Originally posted by Mark Stonich
[email protected] (tom) wrote in message
> > Has anyone ever tried installing S&S couplers in a recumbent. I have a Quetzal C105 with a 2"
> > single tube frame. S&S makes a 2" unit, and I would like to try it, but I would be interested to
> > know if it has been tried and what the results were Dan Burkhart Oakville Ont

> Suggest you talk to Luke at Calhoun Cycles in Mpls,Minnesota.(calhouncycle.com)
>
> I beleive he has some experience with S&S Couplers. Tom H

Calhoun only has them installed in bikes with triangulated frames. Just Rockets and Screamers so
far. The initial plan was for me to install them. But then Curt Goodrich, who has installed hundreds
of them, moved back to this area.

Curt is the best frame builder you never heard of. He's worked in some of the biggest name frame
shops and currently builds Rivendell frames. Currently, Luke has a converted Rocket, powdercoated a
georgeous blue, and a coupled Screamer.

Before deciding on S&S, Luke had me do a proto with couplers I made.
http://mnhpva.org/MNbikes/Rocket.html More work, but saved the cost of the S&S couplers.
Structurally I prefer my method, but the S&S are better looking and a known quantity, and therefore
easy to sell.

Dan, If you want to try to clone the upper clamp, for your Quetzal, the outer tube is 2.125" 4130
and the inner sleeve is 2" x 0.250 6061 turned down on a lathe to 0.0005" less than the ID of the
main tube. Don't thrust the nominal ID of the tube, cut the frame and measure the ID in 4 directions
and average the measurements. Tubes aren't all that round. Long pinch bolts were made from 1/2" cold
rolled 1018.

Thanks Mike. You have given me some good ideas. The Quetzal is overbuilt as opposed to engineered, so I think something like that would work.
D.B.

 

[Dan Burkhart]

Originally posted by Mark Stonich
[email protected] (tom) wrote in message
> > Has anyone ever tried installing S&S couplers in a recumbent. I have a Quetzal C105 with a 2"
> > single tube frame. S&S makes a 2" unit, and I would like to try it, but I would be interested to
> > know if it has been tried and what the results were Dan Burkhart Oakville Ont

> Suggest you talk to Luke at Calhoun Cycles in Mpls,Minnesota.(calhouncycle.com)
>
> I beleive he has some experience with S&S Couplers. Tom H

Calhoun only has them installed in bikes with triangulated frames. Just Rockets and Screamers so
far. The initial plan was for me to install them. But then Curt Goodrich, who has installed hundreds
of them, moved back to this area.

Curt is the best frame builder you never heard of. He's worked in some of the biggest name frame
shops and currently builds Rivendell frames. Currently, Luke has a converted Rocket, powdercoated a
georgeous blue, and a coupled Screamer.

Before deciding on S&S, Luke had me do a proto with couplers I made.
http://mnhpva.org/MNbikes/Rocket.html More work, but saved the cost of the S&S couplers.
Structurally I prefer my method, but the S&S are better looking and a known quantity, and therefore
easy to sell.

Dan, If you want to try to clone the upper clamp, for your Quetzal, the outer tube is 2.125" 4130
and the inner sleeve is 2" x 0.250 6061 turned down on a lathe to 0.0005" less than the ID of the
main tube. Don't thrust the nominal ID of the tube, cut the frame and measure the ID in 4 directions
and average the measurements. Tubes aren't all that round. Long pinch bolts were made from 1/2" cold
rolled 1018.

Oops sorry, I got your name wrong Mark. Inexcusable.
D.B.

 

[Carol Hague]

Tom Sherman <[email protected]> wrote:

> Jay wrote:
>
> > Actually they are used on the main tube of some Greenspeed trikes. http://www.greenspeed.com.au
>
> But the seat on a Greenspeed trike is rigidly attached to the frame fore and aft of the coupler so
> there would not the same magnitude of torsional loading on the coupler of a Greenspeed, as there
> would be on a monotube frame single-track recumbent.

The frame of our Greenspeed tandem has three couplings on the main tubes
:-
<http://www.wrhpv.com/greenspeed/gtt/disassembly/tand08.jpg>
<http://www.wrhpv.com/greenspeed/gtt/disassembly/tand10.jpg>

show the locations fairly well. There are also two small couplings fastening the top of the rear
seat to the frame :-

<http://www.wrhpv.com/greenspeed/gtt/disassembly/tand14.jpg>

The one on my GTO is behind the front fastening for the seat, which is the only point at which the
seat is fastened to the main tube - the other fastening is at the top of the rear triangle.

--
Carol Hague Westcountry Recumbents http://www.trikescdrom.com Feet first on three wheels.

 

[Marc Rosenbaum]

Hi All

I have a 2 inch monotube Volae and I've been eyeing the idea of a coupling as well. I'm somewhat
baffled as to why a monotube frame is off-limits for a coupler. The frame itself is probably 0.035
- 0.045 wall thickness. It should be easy to make a coupling that is stronger than the frame. I
imagine that some attention should be paid to ensuring that there aren't stress concentrations at
the joint between the coupling and the tubing. I have a 30+ year old Raleigh 20 folder that is a
monotube folder. It's heavy, of course, but it is a monotube.

Marc

[email protected] (Mark Stonich) wrote in message
news:<[email protected]>...
> [email protected] (tom) wrote in message
> > > Has anyone ever tried installing S&S couplers in a recumbent. I have a Quetzal C105 with a 2"
> > > single tube frame. S&S makes a 2" unit, and I would like to try it, but I would be interested
> > > to know if it has been tried and what the results were Dan Burkhart Oakville Ont
>
> > Suggest you talk to Luke at Calhoun Cycles in Mpls,Minnesota.(calhouncycle.com)
> >
> > I beleive he has some experience with S&S Couplers. Tom H
>
> Calhoun only has them installed in bikes with triangulated frames. Just Rockets and Screamers so
> far. The initial plan was for me to install them. But then Curt Goodrich, who has installed
> hundreds of them, moved back to this area.
>
> Curt is the best frame builder you never heard of. He's worked in some of the biggest name frame
> shops and currently builds Rivendell frames. Currently, Luke has a converted Rocket, powdercoated
> a georgeous blue, and a coupled Screamer.
>
> Before deciding on S&S, Luke had me do a proto with couplers I made.
> http://mnhpva.org/MNbikes/Rocket.html More work, but saved the cost of the S&S couplers.
> Structurally I prefer my method, but the S&S are better looking and a known quantity, and
> therefore easy to sell.
>
> Dan, If you want to try to clone the upper clamp, for your Quetzal, the outer tube is 2.125" 4130
> and the inner sleeve is 2" x 0.250 6061 turned down on a lathe to 0.0005" less than the ID of the
> main tube. Don't thrust the nominal ID of the tube, cut the frame and measure the ID in 4
> directions and average the measurements. Tubes aren't all that round. Long pinch bolts were made
> from 1/2" cold rolled 1018.