Contador - I Will Never Admire Armstrong

[leerobbs]

I think you are wrong. The tour is much bigger then Lance. As I said , in the eighties there were almost 300k on Alpe D'huez (when the dutch were winning the stages). In California, Australia or the UK the fans would be there for LA. In the more traditional countries like France, Italy, Belgium or Spain, the fans come for the event. The press however will be more interested in LA. He is not the Tiger Woods of cycling, he is the Lance Armstrong of cycling. A guy who wins 7 TdF's deserves respect and shouldn't be compared with someone from another sport. I respect him but I also respect AC (maybe the greatest GT-cyclist ever). But they will never be at the same height of Merckx, Hinault or Coppi.

Your first comment about the tour being much bigger than LA, makes me think you did not read his post. He began by saying its hard to see a difference in the crowds with or w/o LA since it is such a big event. Let' wait a few more years before we declare AC the best GT ever. He might in fact prove to be but it is way to early to even speculate at this point. I guess you think Red Grange is the best college football player too.

 

[Boestering]

Your first comment about the tour being much bigger than LA, makes me think you did not read his post. He began by saying its hard to see a difference in the crowds with or w/o LA since it is such a big event. Let' wait a few more years before we declare AC the best GT ever. He might in fact prove to be but it is way to early to even speculate at this point. I guess you think Red Grange is the best college football player too.

Sorry, I commented on the post where he says a lot of the 500k fans were there just for Armstrong. I don't know who Red Grange is, but when someone who's only 26 wins 4 GT's he must be very good. I've been following cycling since 1980 and only Hinault made a bigger impression on me. That's why I think he is MAYBE the best GT ever.

 

[leerobbs]

Sorry, I commented on the post where he says a lot of the 500k fans were there just for Armstrong. I don't know who Red Grange is, but when someone who's only 26 wins 4 GT's he must be very good. I've been following cycling since 1980 and only Hinault made a bigger impression on me. That's why I think he is MAYBE the best GT ever.

Case closed.

 

[gtm]

Apparently Contadors' off the Garmin (I hope too begin planning in earnest the utter demolition of old man Lance next year)

Euro Peloton - Pro Cycling News

 

[TheDangerMan]

Sorry, I commented on the post where he says a lot of the 500k fans were there just for Armstrong. I don't know who Red Grange is, but when someone who's only 26 wins 4 GT's he must be very good. I've been following cycling since 1980 and only Hinault made a bigger impression on me. That's why I think he is MAYBE the best GT ever.

Well he is yet to prove he is better than the great Armstrong, but if he keeps this dominance going he might well be. The truth is, though, that the opposition hasn't been great for Contador until this year, whereas Armstrong faced down the best to win most of his tours. Even Armstrong at 38 would have beaten the Contador from a year or two ago. That's why for me this year is Contador's first big win. If he can time trial like that again for another seven years, and not get involved in any scandals, then I will hold my hands up and admit he is better than Armstrong.(though even then his body will not have come back from kemo!)

 

[mitosis]

Good thread. Just want to keep up with it.

 

[steve]

If he can time trial like that again for another seven years, and not get involved in any scandals, then I will hold my hands up and admit he is better than Armstrong.

You could argue he needs to win 3 more grand tours to be even with Armstrong.

 

[TheDangerMan]

You could argue he needs to win 3 more grand tours to be even with Armstrong.

My point is he hasn't faced any good opposition until this year. The only decent guy he was up against was Rusmussen and he whipped his butt until he own team pulled the plug.

 

[steve]

My point is he hasn't faced any good opposition until this year. The only decent guy he was up against was Rusmussen and he whipped his butt until he own team pulled the plug.

True, didn't time bonuses decide 1st and 2nd in 2007?

 

[DV1976]

Even Armstrong at 38 would have beaten the Contador from a year or two ago. That's why for me this year is Contador's first big win. If he can time trial like that again for another seven years, and not get involved in any scandals, then I will hold my hands up and admit he is better than Armstrong.(though even then his body will not have come back from kemo!)

What a load of bollocks? How do you know that? I claim the opposite, prove me wrong.
As for chemo... I thought cancer made Armstrong a better rider with all that muscle mass transfer and stuff...
You really dont have a clue...

 

[jimmypop]

As for chemo... I thought cancer made Armstrong a better rider with all that muscle mass transfer and stuff...

Why do people keep reciting this sh!t as if it's fact?

Armstrong's people won the PR campaign years ago, it seems. When he first returned after his break with cancer, he was a miserable failure. It's not until he "retired" a second time, fully enlisted the services of Ferrari, dropped off the radar (and out of OOC testing range) for a few months, and then came back to a very high placing in the Tour of Spain.

 

[TheDangerMan]

What a load of bollocks? How do you know that? I claim the opposite, prove me wrong.
As for chemo... I thought cancer made Armstrong a better rider with all that muscle mass transfer and stuff...
You really dont have a clue...

Yes, after the kemo he kept the weight off and worked on a new style - a style that made him the legend that he is - but most sports people, who have been through that level of kemo, would not be able to return. It takes a hell of a lot out of your body.

But yes, it taught him how to deal with pain, which helped him too. What an amazing guy he is. It's such a priviledge for us that we are still allowed to see him race, even though he's past his best.

 

[Obidon]

Hmm, never in my life, I've seen the captain of a team wearing the yellow jersey, pulling the rest of the team, so that they can finish on the 2nd or 3rd spot.

AC DID got the whole picture, and did what he had to do to keep the yellow.

To be honest, I would love to see AC on the saxo bank team

No you haven't ever seen the captain of a team wearing yellow pull the rest of the team up to 2nd and 3rd because it hasn't happened since 1914. That was the plan, to do something nobody has done for quite some time. Contador couldn't handle being one of many. He didn't have the discipline or intelligence to see that what Astana could have done, would have have been added to his own prestige. All he could see was that the spotlight was shared and he couldn't handle that. Yet, he should have known from the start that he would have to share that spotlight with Armstrong. The man can now go off to ride for a mediocre Spanish team and contend for the polka-dot jersey for rest of his career. Case de Espana is no Astana, Saxo Bank, or anything near a power house team. All the great talents that would be needed for him excel are already under contract to other teams. He will have to do it alone on some mediocre squad next year.

 

[slyjackson]

No you haven't ever seen the captain of a team wearing yellow pull the rest of the team up to 2nd and 3rd because it hasn't happened since 1914. That was the plan, to do something nobody has done for quite some time. Contador couldn't handle being one of many. He didn't have the discipline or intelligence to see that what Astana could have done, would have have been added to his own prestige. All he could see was that the spotlight was shared and he couldn't handle that. Yet, he should have known from the start that he would have to share that spotlight with Armstrong. The man can now go off to ride for a mediocre Spanish team and contend for the polka-dot jersey for rest of his career. Case de Espana is no Astana, Saxo Bank, or anything near a power house team. All the great talents that would be needed for him excel are already under contract to other teams. He will have to do it alone on some mediocre squad next year.

+1 Well said !

 

[poulidor]

No you haven't ever seen the captain of a team wearing yellow pull the rest of the team up to 2nd and 3rd because it hasn't happened since 1914. That was the plan, to do something nobody has done for quite some time. Contador couldn't handle being one of many. He didn't have the discipline or intelligence to see that what Astana could have done, would have have been added to his own prestige. All he could see was that the spotlight was shared and he couldn't handle that. Yet, he should have known from the start that he would have to share that spotlight with Armstrong. The man can now go off to ride for a mediocre Spanish team and contend for the polka-dot jersey for rest of his career. Case de Espana is no Astana, Saxo Bank, or anything near a power house team. All the great talents that would be needed for him excel are already under contract to other teams. He will have to do it alone on some mediocre squad next year.

ha ha ha!
Ferrari has already did the 1 2 3 on a TDF!

Should we suppose that the plan was already set after Paris-Nice when Lance gave his first lesson?

 

[swampy1970]

I dont like it when people take pikchors out of context. Having said that I dont like pikchors being created with little to no contextual relevance.

To imply the whole astana team loved Lance and hated Contador to the point of avoiding him on the final stage is retarded. Relying on this image as proof is further retardation.

Contextual relevance. You found the spell checker I see.

I'm not sure if you just resurfaced after a month under a large rock but it was no secret that there was no love between most of the team and Alberto.

Normally it's a matter of both pride and duty for a team to lead the yellow jersey across the finish line in Paris not only because it's their job but also for the huge photo opporunity for sponsors etc... I don't recall any other tour where the Jersey hasn't been surrounded by teammates and I've watched all but 3 Tours since 1984.

 

[swampy1970]

No you haven't ever seen the captain of a team wearing yellow pull the rest of the team up to 2nd and 3rd because it hasn't happened since 1914. That was the plan, to do something nobody has done for quite some time. Contador couldn't handle being one of many. He didn't have the discipline or intelligence to see that what Astana could have done, would have have been added to his own prestige. All he could see was that the spotlight was shared and he couldn't handle that. Yet, he should have known from the start that he would have to share that spotlight with Armstrong. The man can now go off to ride for a mediocre Spanish team and contend for the polka-dot jersey for rest of his career. Case de Espana is no Astana, Saxo Bank, or anything near a power house team. All the great talents that would be needed for him excel are already under contract to other teams. He will have to do it alone on some mediocre squad next year.

Astana couldn't have pulled the podium sweep off even with Levi still in the race. Schleck Jr was too good for Lance and Kloden as it was.

 

[limerickman]

Contextual relevance. You found the spell checker I see.

I'm not sure if you just resurfaced after a month under a large rock but it was no secret that there was no love between most of the team and Alberto.

Normally it's a matter of both pride and duty for a team to lead the yellow jersey across the finish line in Paris not only because it's their job but also for the huge photo opporunity for sponsors etc... I don't recall any other tour where the Jersey hasn't been surrounded by teammates and I've watched all but 3 Tours since 1984.

Thats what GV was more or less implying.
Try reading the posters remarks.

 

[tonyzackery]

I'm not sure if you just resurfaced after a month under a large rock but it was no secret that there was no love between most of the team and Alberto.

Normally it's a matter of both pride and duty for a team to lead the yellow jersey across the finish line in Paris not only because it's their job but also for the huge photo opporunity for sponsors etc... I don't recall any other tour where the Jersey hasn't been surrounded by teammates and I've watched all but 3 Tours since 1984.

I'm not buying the assertion that the Astana team loved Gunderson and had none for Contador. I'll again propose that Gunderson is the equivalent of a pro cycling mob boss and the underlings had to choose sides - go along with the "don" or get slapped around figuratively by the "don". The underlings knew of the political fallout had they decided to appear to be supporting AC. They were thinking solely about their prospects for employment in the post-Astana years...The guy's connections and power is just too great. Only the TdF winner could afford to defy the "man"...sad, but true IMO...

 

[swampy1970]

What a load of Bollocks.

With respect.

This country has a long history in this sport and it had huge fanbase long before the uniballer said he'd appear here.

In fact Armstrongs announcement to appear at the Tour of Ireland, has had zero effect.

Quite the contrary in fact.
The tour has been reduced from five days to three days.

So you're talking rubbish.

So the fact that the Tour of Ireland has been reduced to 3 days is now Lance's fault and not Rushtons' inability to figure out a good route?