My first Century...plus...

[Rocket_Man]

Well...after about 4 years of saying that I was going to be doing one, I finally signed up for this ride. It will cover up to 175 miles with around 15,000 feet of climbing, in 2 days. I've done research...on these forums and various places on the internet. I feel that I have a fairly descent grasp on what to do for training...for a single day of riding. I don't know exactly what other info you all need, but I have a few questions (I have more...but cant remember them all now)
My goal is just to finish both days...with the most riding I can get in. The Century ride the first day is the most important to me, if I have to cut the second day short...it wouldn't be the end of the world, but I think it might bum me out a little.

As far as a training schedule, I found this. It seems to show up in a few other websites as well, in both 6 or 8 week programs.
-Will this sort of program be ok for a 2 day ride? (100 miles the first...75 the second day) ...would it be wise to add more miles, multiple days with more miles?
-Will just a 6-8 week program be enough? Should I start sooner?

Right now I only have around 350 miles logged in for the year (stupid weather and family plans).
-Should I try to get in more "base miles" before starting the training schedule? ...I can do 30 miles without a problem. I could go longer, but time restraints have held me from going any further...so far.

My wife has shown interest in going on training rides with me. She cant hang with my pace, and I would have to use a Mountain Bike (with a trailer for my kids). I also do a weekly 10 mile TT. But, I still would be able to get out on my own for the longer rides.
-Would the Mountain Bike w/trailer have any adverse effect on the training?
-Will the slower pace from the wife be "bad"? ...I think that with the TT's and some of my own time it wouldn't matter, just checking.

Around my house I have so many different options of how to train. I can cruise around on all "flat" roads, within 3 miles I have a decent climb (1 mile, 7 percent grade...or so), and within about 15 miles I can get to some longer climbs with the same grade. Unfortunately, I cant really train on the roads I will be riding on...I would have to drive about 30 miles, pay for parking, and pay for park entry (wife isn't to keen on that much money being "wasted"). Although on longer rides I may be able to reach them.
-What type of roads would be "best" to train on? ...I'm thinking that it would be best to train on the hills around my house, because of the amount of climbing that I will be doing.
-Any suggestions on how to train on the above recommended roads?

-Would a strength training schedule be a smart choice to start working on? ...I know this is more of an endurance type event, but with all the climbing I think strength would be a good thing to work on also. With that being said, I can easily spin at 90-100 rpm...so cadence really doesn't need much work.

Alright...thats about all the questions I can think of that I have. I know I have more, but I guess that'll have to do for now.

Thanks for your help.

 

[daveryanwyoming]

....My goal is just to finish both days...with the most riding I can get in. The Century ride the first day is the most important to me, if I have to cut the second day short...it wouldn't be the end of the world, but I think it might bum me out a little...

Those goals are reasonable and important to keep in mind. You can certainly train to finish a century in 6 to 8 weeks, especially from a competitive starting point with your TT history. But you probably won't set any records and day two might be rough on limited training base.

...As far as a training schedule, I found this. It seems to show up in a few other websites as well, in both 6 or 8 week programs.
-Will this sort of program be ok for a 2 day ride? (100 miles the first...75 the second day) ...would it be wise to add more miles, multiple days with more miles?...

That sort of schedule is a good starting point but definitely geared towards a beginner. I'd guess with your weekly TTs and riding history you shouldn't have too much trouble exceeding 77 miles in your first week. IIRC, you've done 50+ mile single day fast group training rides even if they were a bit hard on you at the time.

I wouldn't necessarily add more days, 4 to 5 per week is a good starting point but I would consider stretching the length of some days and to define their terms of "pace" and "brisk" relative to your own capabilities. IOW, make sure those "brisk" days get you breathing steadily and deeply and force you to concentrate on your riding and pace. Don't blow yourself totally out and have to quit the rides early, but don't turn the higher end days into sightseeing pleasure cruises. Train on the training days and recover on the easier days...

-Will just a 6-8 week program be enough? Should I start sooner?...

If you have the option of starting sooner, then YES by all means don't wait to start training.

...-Should I try to get in more "base miles" before starting the training schedule? ...

That training plan describes base miles, you don't need to go even easier before starting to work on metabolic fitness and time in the saddle. Cycling base fitness really translates to core aerobic or more accurately metabolic fitness that allows you to generate sustainable power. The program you linked or what we'd call SST (Sweet Spot Training) here is focused on just that. You move away from base building when you add short intervals, sprints, anaerobic work, and such which is all very useful for road racers during mass start events but not very important relative to century rides.

You don't have a lot of foundation this season (pretty impressive that you're doing a weekly TT series with so little riding, train well for this century and your TT times should improve) and may need to ramp your mileage and time in the saddle intelligently, but don't do a bunch of noodling around first. Listen to your body and be willing to do some shorter rides or back off on pace in the early going, but start doing those "pace" and "brisk" rides at your own current abililty level sooner rather than later. In time the pace for those efforts should increase.

-Would the Mountain Bike w/trailer have any adverse effect on the training?
-Will the slower pace from the wife be "bad"? ...I think that with the TT's and some of my own time it wouldn't matter, just checking...

If you go that route then definitely adjust the mountain bike as close as possible to your road bike in terms of fit, seat height, leg angles, etc. You definitely want to do most of your harder training on a bike identical or very similar to what you'll ride in your event. I wouldn't ride slower on your "brisk" and "pace" days but your easier days may be her harder days. The mountain bike and trailer will be somewhat equalizing, but you each need to push yourselves gently beyond your current comfort zones if you want to adapt and improve. If you ride too easily or she tries to go too hard to match your pace then neither of you will be training ideally.

Maybe the mountain bike will balance things, maybe not...you should try it out a few times and see if it works for both of you. FWIW I do roughly 90% of my training solo for just those reasons, even with a group of experienced racers it's hard to train at just the right pace.

OTOH, you're going to want to ride in a group, draft efficiently and work with others during your long events so if your group riding skills need work you should plan to find some local group rides.

-What type of roads would be "best" to train on? ...I'm thinking that it would be best to train on the hills around my house, because of the amount of climbing that I will be doing...-Any suggestions on how to train on the above recommended roads?..

Good training roads have fairly long uninterrupted stretches where you can get up to speed and hold a steady pace for 10, 20, 30 minutes or more without being forced to stop or coast. Longer is better, but it depends on the specific workouts. Both hills and flats can work well, but again look for longer sustained climbs as opposed to minute long "sprinters hills" to build core metabolic fitness.

...-Would a strength training schedule be a smart choice to start working on?...

No, strength training is not going to help your sustainable power nor your ability to climb on the bike. Yeah, it sure feels that way, but if you're a healthy adult and can walk up a short flight of stairs you have the peak strength you need to ride and even to race. What you need is the ability to press on the pedals with 20 to 40 pounds of force 80 to 100 times a minute for hours on end, that comes down to the ability to convert fuels to power and not strength. You need to train for metabolic fitness and time spent lifting won't help you there.

Good luck,
-Dave

 

[Rocket_Man]

Update...yeah, its been a month, oops.

Yeah, I don't know. Really, all the questions I have...are just basic stuff that I already know. Just like to double check to make sure that I'm not doing the wrong thing.

I think my longest ride last year was around 45 miles..."fast" pace, hard to keep up. Tomorrow I'm going out for a 52 mile solo ride. I'm feeling very confident that everything is going to be great...and I'll be getting on some of the roads that I'll be riding on in September. Also, FFIW, I'll be climbing up to Mt. Rushmore!!! I've been planning a ride up to the faces for about 2 years now...just never have done it.

My mountain bike is set up almost exactly like my road bike...except no drop bars. I don't really like doing the off roading stuff anyway...so I set it up for the road. When my wife does want to train with me, its my only option. Its alright, but its started to become less often. She just doesn't have the same goals as me right now, so its hard for her to stay focused. She has shown interest in starting to train over the winter to ride with me next year though. Hopefully by then we might be able to get a new road bike too.

I've FINALLY been able to log in more miles on the road. The early part of the season, no, I didn't get many miles put in...so I spent alot of time on the trainer. Just like you said Dave...my TT time has came down quite a bit. I think a month ago, my fastest 10 mile TT time was around 26:30. This last Tuesday...I pulled off a 24:26!!! (Personal best too!!!) Maybe I should revive my old TT question thread, but I'll ask here...it may help my overall riding too.

Cadence??? Since my last series of questions I finally got a computer with cadence...so that I knew where I was exactly. To my suprise, my comfortable cadence is 95-100 rpm, with 100-110 rpm being not that hard to spin either, both on the flats or going up a hill. What I've been doing lately (especially in the TT's) is to try not to go over 95 rpm and to push a harder gear. Yes, I do go faster...but my legs let me know that the cadence isn't as comfortable. So now, what do I do to get used of spinning a little slower/turning a bigger gear? OR...should I just go back to spinning faster??? I've read the "Gyming to improve speed" (or whatever that thread is called) While what seems like common sense tries to kick in and say if your legs are stronger, you'll go faster...I'm finally being able to understand thats not true.
---What I'm thinking is that its just a matter of time for my legs to come around. Push that 1 gear harder (while still spinning at around 87-92 rpm) and soon that will creep up into the 95-100 mark. Then work the next gear. Wash, rinse, repeat. I know other training will help too, but that the basic idea... Correct???

Thanks again for your help

 

[swampy1970]

I've FINALLY been able to log in more miles on the road. The early part of the season, no, I didn't get many miles put in...so I spent alot of time on the trainer. Just like you said Dave...my TT time has came down quite a bit. I think a month ago, my fastest 10 mile TT time was around 26:30. This last Tuesday...I pulled off a 24:26!!! (Personal best too!!!) Maybe I should revive my old TT question thread, but I'll ask here...it may help my overall riding too.

Cadence??? Since my last series of questions I finally got a computer with cadence...so that I knew where I was exactly. To my suprise, my comfortable cadence is 95-100 rpm, with 100-110 rpm being not that hard to spin either, both on the flats or going up a hill. What I've been doing lately (especially in the TT's) is to try not to go over 95 rpm and to push a harder gear. Yes, I do go faster...but my legs let me know that the cadence isn't as comfortable. So now, what do I do to get used of spinning a little slower/turning a bigger gear? OR...should I just go back to spinning faster??? I've read the "Gyming to improve speed" (or whatever that thread is called) While what seems like common sense tries to kick in and say if your legs are stronger, you'll go faster...I'm finally being able to understand thats not true.
---What I'm thinking is that its just a matter of time for my legs to come around. Push that 1 gear harder (while still spinning at around 87-92 rpm) and soon that will creep up into the 95-100 mark. Then work the next gear. Wash, rinse, repeat. I know other training will help too, but that the basic idea... Correct???

Thanks again for your help

Cadance is actually pretty easy to figure out and you can do this during intervals on the trainer if you'd like. Do your first interval at your normal cadence. Rest. Do your second interval in the next bigger gear and note speed. Rest. Do the next in the next bigger gear and note speed.

When testing like this I like to keep each interval around 10 minutes and rests around 5.

If you want verification of the results, try the same intervals but in reverse - so biggest gear, next smaller and smallest. Of course if you found originally that you got slower each time the try a gear smaller (and pedal faster) that what you normally do.

Time trials are all about getting from the start to finish as fast as possible. There are no style points for looking cool, pedalling fast or going so hard that you drool down your chin and ooze snot from your nose. What ever gives you the best speed works for your current state of training/fitness. If that means a cadence of 70rpm on race day then 70 rpm it is. That may increase over time if you train at a higher cadence but your race pace and cadence is what it is at that given point in time.

... and congrats on the personal best. You'll be cracking that 25mph average pretty soon.

 

[Rocket_Man]

Time trials are all about getting from the start to finish as fast as possible. There are no style points for looking cool, pedalling fast or going so hard that you drool down your chin and ooze snot from your nose. What ever gives you the best speed works for your current state of training/fitness. If that means a cadence of 70rpm on race day then 70 rpm it is. That may increase over time if you train at a higher cadence but your race pace and cadence is what it is at that given point in time.

So...is it just hype about trying to keep at least 90 rpm? I cant imagine TTing with only 70 rpm, my legs would probably fall off!!! I do see what you are saying though, don't rely on cadence so much...go on feel.
Then, what about my road ride in Sept. I guess that would apply also? Hmmm...maybe I'm slightly confused.

... and congrats on the personal best. You'll be cracking that 25mph average pretty soon.

Thank you!!! Yeah...this week is looking like another fast night. I hope that I can cut the extra 24 seconds off!!!

I got through my 50 mile ride this weekend. New issue. I've never had quad pain like I did in the last 5-7 miles. They HURT!!! Not to the point of not being able to ride...but it was difficult to try to keep any kind of good pace. Like I said...I don't think I've ever had that kind of feeling in my quads before. So, I'm thinking that I made a HUGE mistake at the 30 mile mark. After climbing (then descending) Mt.Rushmore (the climb itself is 2 miles @ 6.6% avg. grade) I was asked to stop in to see a friend at a coffee shop. The visit ended up being around 30 min. (20 min longer than I was planning), it was supposed to be just to fill up bottles and say Hi. Also, after the stop, there was a gradual climb (2-3% for about 7-10 miles).
--I'm thinking the stop is what killed my legs.
And, after getting to my family reunion...stretching, showering, and taking a break for about 20-30 min...my legs were fine. I'm *not to* worried about it, but it has me wondering what could have been if I'd been on my Century.
Sound right...any suggestions?
Thanks for your help again

 

[swampy1970]

So...is it just hype about trying to keep at least 90 rpm? I cant imagine TTing with only 70 rpm, my legs would probably fall off!!! I do see what you are saying though, don't rely on cadence so much...go on feel.
Then, what about my road ride in Sept. I guess that would apply also? Hmmm...maybe I'm slightly confused.

Thank you!!! Yeah...this week is looking like another fast night. I hope that I can cut the extra 24 seconds off!!!

I got through my 50 mile ride this weekend. New issue. I've never had quad pain like I did in the last 5-7 miles. They HURT!!! Not to the point of not being able to ride...but it was difficult to try to keep any kind of good pace. Like I said...I don't think I've ever had that kind of feeling in my quads before. So, I'm thinking that I made a HUGE mistake at the 30 mile mark. After climbing (then descending) Mt.Rushmore (the climb itself is 2 miles @ 6.6% avg. grade) I was asked to stop in to see a friend at a coffee shop. The visit ended up being around 30 min. (20 min longer than I was planning), it was supposed to be just to fill up bottles and say Hi. Also, after the stop, there was a gradual climb (2-3% for about 7-10 miles).
--I'm thinking the stop is what killed my legs.
And, after getting to my family reunion...stretching, showering, and taking a break for about 20-30 min...my legs were fine. I'm *not to* worried about it, but it has me wondering what could have been if I'd been on my Century.
Sound right...any suggestions?
Thanks for your help again

It's not hype - most people do well around 90rpm but I suspect largely because they've been told to train at that rpm so it's what they become used too. I just used that as an example but the theory remains, everyone is different and for the sake of maximising results in an event that may be important to you, you need to know what works best for you and not what was the average rpm for the last 50 years of Tour de France time trialists.

Feel... I wouldn't use "feel" to figure out what's best. The stopwatch will tell you whats best and often what's fastest feels rather grim. Going fast and feeling fast are often two different things.

A short time trial and a 175mile ride are two different beasts. The former is almost a test of will as it is power and efficiency while the latter is all about pacing and feeding. Two different things entirely, but if you have lots of climbing then it's a similar deal - what rpm are you best at climbing at and can you sustain that for lots of miles?

I recently finished the Alta Alpina Challenge - 198 miles and 21,000ft of climbing in a day (at altitude) so I can relate to the event that you're going to do. When it comes to an event like that you either have the legs or you don't. You train in advance and sort out a schedule based up something realistic, ie when riding in training at the pace you can sustain for 12+hours, on a hill of similar gradient, can you go fast enough to beat the cut off times? If you plan it well (pacing, gearing, feeding) the event is actually pretty straight forward and easy. If it's a well established ride, get some info from the interweb or the event organizers about pacing, cut off times (if there are any) and base your training around that.

 

[daveryanwyoming]

...So...is it just hype about trying to keep at least 90 rpm?...

Yep, pretty much.

Some folks TT fastest in lighter gears but many set their best times slugging away at bigger gears at least on steady flatter courses. Don't get hung up on what any particular cyclist does in terms of gears and cadence and find out what works best for you. This is another place where PM data is invaluable but keep track of the distance covered in your weekly 20 to 30 minute training intervals while using different gears and you should be able to figure out what works best for you.

FWIW, I used to TT in lighter gears spinning 95-105 rpm average for up to an hour. I started playing with bigger gears and lower cadences and my sustained power has risen while my times have dropped. I finished a TT a couple of weeks ago with my highest sustained power for the distance, an average cadence of 78 and a podium spot. I sure wasn't targeting any particular cadence just hammering bigger gears and shifting up at every opportunity and shifting down only when I felt I was close to losing it. No saying whether that will work for you, but don't be afraid to try different strategies in training or during less important races regardless of what others say.

Leg speed and the ability to ride higher cadences is very useful for general riding, distance and especially for dynamic mass start racing where you need to be able to accelerate frequently and on demand to cover attacks, surges, close gaps out of corners, etc. So it definitely pays to develop the ability to spin smooth and fast for a lot of reasons but time trials should be ridden in the way that gets you to the line quickest as Swampy pointed out and that may or may not involve high rpms.

I rode a crit the evening after the morning TT, my average cadence was over 100 rpm with many bursts up past 140 rpm and peak cadence of 183 rpm along the way. I managed a podium spot in that race as well, the point is that different races call for different tactics including gear choices and the cadence that results from it. It certainly pays to have a wide useable range and so it pays to train across a range of leg speeds but you need to find out what works for you in a given race.

...The visit ended up being around 30 min...

Yeah, that's not a good idea in the middle of a long ride. I'm always amazed to see folks stretched out on lawns taking leisurely and long breaks or even naps in the middle of century ride. It's hard enough to warm up once in the morning but hell to have to do it all over again late in the day. For your century, try to keep breaks to 5 minutes or less if you can.

-Dave

 

[Rocket_Man]

Yeah, Cadence is way more clear now. Just like most everything else...here's the ballpark number, adjust as needed. I'll have to start really paying attention to whats working (or not working), and improve on it!

A nap during a century?!? Wow, to me that would be more like 2 rides in one day. If I took a nap, I wouldn't feel as though I succeeded in riding a century. Yeah, that break was rather long. Actually, I've been looking over the route map...looks like I should easily be able to skip every other break spot. And yeah, when I do take a break its going to be to fill bottles and grab a bite to eat (use the bathroom if needed)...should only take 5-10 min max.

 

[Rocket_Man]

Good news...since I've been watching my cadence (and SPEED), I've knocked a few more seconds off (24:19, then 24:13 tonight). I've gained some more confidence that I'll DEFINITELY get into the 23:XX range. I almost rode the whole route in the big ring. Previously, I rode the way out in the middle ring...then switched to the big one on the way back (uphill out, downhill back). I still cant start in the big ring though. It just seems that my starts are not as fast (maybe its a perception thing?)...and at the turnaround, again I don't seem as fast.
Thanks guys for your help...and any more advice is appreciated.

What I've been thinking about lately is ... Approximately how fast do Gels, bars, and energy drinks start to work?
What got me thinking about it was on Sunday I went on a group ride. The ride was VERY casual (30 miles in 2:30:00 or so). I didn't think the pace was going to be that slow...but whatever. Anyway, I ate about 2 hours before we went out. All that I did during the ride was drink water and Gatorade. On the other hand...one of the guys on the ride...popped about 3 Gels throughout the ride (one at the beginning, then about each hour). I just thought that was alot.
When I was out a few weeks ago (50 miles, about 3 hours), I had a good meal about 2-3 hours prior, stayed plenty hydrated, but only had 1 Clif Bar at about the halfway mark.
So, thinking this might be a little hard to answer, but did I eat enough on my 50 mile ride? Or, do you think he overdid it on the 30 miler? ...this is probably one of those "everybody is different" situations, isn't it? **sigh**
Regardless, the reason I ask is for my ride in September. I've read that you want to consume about 2-300 calories every hour (depending the speed, heat, distance, time, effort, etc). So, I'm assuming that its best to have both Bars and Gels with you for a Century. Also, there will be PB&J sandwiches, bananas, etc provided along the way. I'll obviously want to watch what I eat and when (don't want to be stuffed for a big climb or anything)...but at what point would you opt for a Bar vs. Gel (or vice-versa)??

 

[Rocket_Man]

Alright...I got a new one for you guys. Maybe not new, just odd for me.

Yesterday's TT, I got a new personal best 24:05! So, I cant complain, but I think I could have gone faster. Here's what the problem is...curious if you have any answers.
I decided to do my own research on how Bar vs. Gels effect me, if at all. I prepared the same as I always do...ate the same food, got ready, packed up, all at about the same time. I found out as I was eating my spaghetti that my wife allowed our friend to add a little bit of sausage "for taste". It wasn't to bad...I didn't think anything of it.
From the time I left my house, till start time was the only difference. Normally I eat a Clif bar and drink a bottle of Gatorade (Start eating at about 40 min out, drinking all the way up to my start time). Yesterday, I skipped the Clif bar...still drank the same...but instead used a Gel pack about 15 min before my start time. Warmup was about the same (time and distance)...but seemed "harder"?
My start time came up. The first two miles seemed SLOW!!! Honestly, I cant tell you if they were...mainly I was thinking about how slow it seemed, and what I could do to push myself. THEN, for the next 1/2 to a mile I felt like I was going to be throwing up at any second (I haven't had that feeling forever). I caught my 30 second and minute person on the same hill as I normally do. Started descending the hill...and BAM! felt 100+% I took off!!! The rest of the way to the turn around and back...it felt like I couldn't push myself hard enough, I seemed to be flying. Definitely the fastest I've ever returned without a tail wind.

So, I guess what I'm wondering is...
Was the start "slow" due to not as many calories? or maybe the addition of the sausage in the spaghetti?
What about the feeling of throwing up? I suppose again, food intake...
I'm assuming that the "Power Surge" was due to the Gel? about the only thing I can think off.
Next week, I'm now thinking of eating both the Clif bar and taking the Gel? A wise decision as of right now...I think

Anyway, what do you all think...am I on the right track?

 

[daveryanwyoming]

Yeah, sounds like you're on the right track.

I think I've said this before, but I'll repeat it since it doesn't seem to have sunk in.

The food you eat in the last five to six hours before your event has no positive impact on your TT, but can have negative impact if you eat too much, too close to the event or the wrong things that are tough to digest.

If you're eating normally throughout your week and not training ridiculous miles you should have between 1200 and 1800 Calories worth of glycogen strored in your leg muscles and a few hundred stored in your liver when you start your TT. Even if you average 500 watts for a 30 minute TT you'll only burn through approximately 900 Calories during the TT. At a more modest 300 watts you'd only burn ~ 450 Calories in 24 minutes.

The point is that the energy demands of your TT do not require aggressive prerace fueling and you're almost certainly doing more harm than good by trying to eat spaghetti (red sauce I take it), bars, gels and even energy drink as your event approaches. You simply cannot burn through even modest glycogen stores in an event that short unless you were glycogen depleted when you woke up in the morning, but even then you've already blown it and the last minute fueling is too little, too late.

Sure psychologically it's nice to have a bit of food on board and not go to the line with a grumbling stomach. But you will not improve performance in a 24 minute TT by eating in the final hours before your event and as you've experienced more than once you can definitely do harm.

Again check out the recommendations in the Hammer nutrition guide: http://www.hammernutrition.com/downloads/fuelinghandbook.pdf

Note that they recommend the last solid food 3 hours before an event and actually recommend skipping that meal entirely and showing up for races (including long road races) on an empty stomach if you'd have to skip sleep to eat 3 hours before an early morning event. I think that's an extreme stance, but read their arguments on why those final energy bars and meals just don't matter.

Hard to say why you felt tired during warmup and felt bad during your ride, it certainly happens sometimes. Sounds like you made the best of it and are still on target for your 23 minute time. But do yourself a favor and eat nothing solid for the last couple of hours before your TTs and go very light and stay conservative in your last meal (no experiments with sausage, meats, cheeses, heavy sauces). Those meals will not help you go faster and may hurt.

Good luck,
-Dave

 

[DancenMacabre]

Yeah, sounds like you're on the right track.

I think I've said this before, but I'll repeat it since it doesn't seem to have sunk in.

The food you eat in the last five to six hours before your event has no positive impact on your TT, but can have negative impact if you eat too much, too close to the event or the wrong things that are tough to digest.

If you're eating normally throughout your week and not training ridiculous miles you should have between 1200 and 1800 Calories worth of glycogen strored in your leg muscles and a few hundred stored in your liver when you start your TT. Even if you average 500 watts for a 30 minute TT you'll only burn through approximately 900 Calories during the TT. At a more modest 300 watts you'd only burn ~ 450 Calories in 24 minutes.

The point is that the energy demands of your TT do not require aggressive prerace fueling and you're almost certainly doing more harm than good by trying to eat spaghetti (red sauce I take it), bars, gels and even energy drink as your event approaches. You simply cannot burn through even modest glycogen stores in an event that short unless you were glycogen depleted when you woke up in the morning, but even then you've already blown it and the last minute fueling is too little, too late.

Sure psychologically it's nice to have a bit of food on board and not go to the line with a grumbling stomach. But you will not improve performance in a 24 minute TT by eating in the final hours before your event and as you've experienced more than once you can definitely do harm.

Again check out the recommendations in the Hammer nutrition guide: http://www.hammernutrition.com/downloads/fuelinghandbook.pdf

Note that they recommend the last solid food 3 hours before an event and actually recommend skipping that meal entirely and showing up for races (including long road races) on an empty stomach if you'd have to skip sleep to eat 3 hours before an early morning event. I think that's an extreme stance, but read their arguments on why those final energy bars and meals just don't matter.

Hard to say why you felt tired during warmup and felt bad during your ride, it certainly happens sometimes. Sounds like you made the best of it and are still on target for your 23 minute time. But do yourself a favor and eat nothing solid for the last couple of hours before your TTs and go very light and stay conservative in your last meal (no experiments with sausage, meats, cheeses, heavy sauces). Those meals will not help you go faster and may hurt.

Good luck,
-Dave

Hi Mr. Dave. That was a super helpful comment. The nutrition pdf book has so much great information, not to mention oodles of facts I was totally ignorant about. Your comments on this forum have been most informative to me so thanks for sharing the knowledge

Sorry to interrupt your thread rocket man but I had to just say how useful the info was to me.

Good luck with your big event

 

[Rocket_Man]

No problem DancenMacabre, and thanks for the well wishes!!!

Dang it!!! Yep, Dave, you have told me all this before. **sigh** I don't want to say that it hasn't sunk in...more likely...with all the other info that I'm getting, it got lost in the jumble. Hmmm...it makes me feel better to think of it that way. Anyway...THANK YOU for that link. Very Helpful!!! (about half way through it at the moment)

This has really put it back into perspective for me. I think what my problem is, that I'm a beginner (but with more knowledge than the average beginner). So, I'm trying to take all the info, cram it all together, and take it to "the next level"...without getting a full grasp on the "basics". So, from here on...basics for me!!! I have a lot of trial and errors to do, but thats part of learning.

For what its worth...I had a learning experience tonight!!! **sigh** I had my bike in the shop to get a new chain and "rebuild" the headset (I picked up my bike on the way to the race). Arrived to the race at my normal time, filled up the tires, and off I went to warm up. Wait a minute...my front end alignment is way off! Seriously, looking straight down through my aero bars, it appeared that my tire nearly touched the left one!!! About an inch off center? So, got out the tools and fixed it. Leaving me with about 5-8 minutes to warm up (my normal is 20-25 min.)
Needless to say, around the 7.5 mile mark, my diaphragm started to HURT! Hard to breath, and got so painful that I finally had thoughts of sitting up and just coasting in. I didn't, but finished with a 24:41...way off of the 23:xx that I was hoping for. At least, that's what the problem the guys at the race could think of, lack of warm up.
Well, I've learned the importance of warm up from last year...just another example to learn from.
...There's always next week!!! (Last one for the season )

 

[Rocket_Man]

Finally got it!!! 23:45!!! I think I can honestly say... "I left it all out on the road". Had to thank one guy after the race though, I could hear him coming up behind me (mainly his breathing), with 1 mile to go. I thought... PUSH! Your 23:xx depends on it. So I did...pushed that extra little bit, shifted down one, and pulled away.

So now all I have left for the year is my ride in a couple of weeks. All training sessions are now focused to that...although, I don't really know what I'll be doing different ?

Anyway, I have a question for ya'll. I've talked to the race directors...they have no problem with leaving aero bars on. Should I????
I'm torn 50/50 between leaving them on or taking them off. I've weighed out the pro's and con's and still cant decide. 1)Taking them off, takes away a position on the bike...but, lightens the bike [about a pound?] 2)Can only really use them if I'm by myself...but, I would like to try to hook up with a group 3)Cant use them while climbing bigger hills...there's 15,000' of climbing between the two days [8,600 day one/7,000 day two] <---this also needs to be considered in #1. There's a bunch of other stuff that I've over thought/analyzed too
I just don't know...What do you guys think?

 

[daveryanwyoming]

Take the aero bars off unless they're set in a very high and comfortable position that you could ride for hours on end and you plan to do a lot of solo riding. Of course if that's the case then work on a lower more aero position before next year's TT season rolls around.

But basically you really want to be riding in groups as much as possible and you shouldn't be riding the aero bars in a group so they'll just be dead weight. I sure wouldn't ride my TT bike in a mass start ride.

-Dave

 

[steve]

But basically you really want to be riding in groups as much as possible and you shouldn't be riding the aero bars in a group so they'll just be dead weight. I sure wouldn't ride my TT bike in a mass start ride.

I absolutely agree with this, using aero bars in a group is a recipe for disaster.

 

[Rocket_Man]

Done and done...they'll be coming off in about 10-15 min. Just needed the push to do it. I totally agree...I wouldn't ride on the aero bars in a group either. I was thinking about leaving them on *if* I got out on my own, but, with that being said...I'm going to try my hardest to stay with a group. Even if that means going a tish slower than my normal pace.

Yep, I would never even consider riding a TT bike in a group style ride either. But, me, having a road bike with aero bars put on, doesn't really give me much choice of what bike to ride. And, yes, thats in the work for the off season...Get used to riding in a MORE aero position. I had mounted my bars underneith the handlebars...but I thought my thighs were hitting the bottom of my ribs. So, with having to remove them for my crit race, I remounted them on top. A little more comfortable yes...but, in 20/20 hind sight, I probably should have mounted them on the underside again.

Thanks for all your help guys...I really do appreciate it!!!