Compulsory helmets again!



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Richard Burton

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Some misguided MPs are being led by the nose by BHIT, which is back to its old tricks of making
ridiculous claims about the efficacy of helmets and the numbers of children who would be saved by
wearing one. The MPs have signed an Early Day Motion (text below) which has been signed, at the
latest count, by 54 of them, including Glenda Jackson, who I thought knew better.

"An attempt to introduce this was made previously by Bristol MP Jean Corston - this attempt failed.
However, this latest attempt already has 46 signatories (Jean Corston isn't one of them yet, nor any
other Bristol MPs) - the proposer is Alan Meale (Mansfield).

Attached is a copy of a letter from a CTC member to his MP re the EDM on helmets which might be
useful as a template if BCC members want to respond similarly. The general thought is that this EDM
will fail due to lack of time, but might be being used as a marker for inclusion in a road safety
bill expected next year.

There is a lot of info generally about helmets - CTC are drawing up a briefing linking the issue
with cycling for health (stating that compulsory helmet use would have a major detrimental overall
effect on health) - http://www.ctc.org.uk

Here is a website that has been recommended as a good resource for info based on the American
experience:

<http://www.magma.ca/~ocbc/hfaq.html>

Copy of letter sent to MP rejecting the Early Day Motion:

Could I draw your attention to the Early Day Motion on behalf of the BICYCLE HELMET INITIATIVE
TRUST and warn you that this motion is full of factual errors if not deliberate deception. The
motion states:-

BICYCLE HELMET INITIATIVE TRUST

That this House notes that every year in the UK approximately 28,000 children under the age of 16
years receive a serious head injury as a result of a cycling accident and that sadly a number die as
a result, whilst for many others their accident will have a devastating impact on their life, in
many cases restricting their abilities to develop, learn new skills, make new friends and face the
lifelong challenges of the world; recognizes that by simply wearing a bicycle helmet 85 per cent. of
such head injuries could be prevented; commends the excellent campaign of the Bicycle Helmet
Initiative Trust to get Parliament to introduce legislation to enforce the wearing of helmets by all
bicyclists in the UK; and calls upon her Majesty's Government to give its full support to such a
proposal which would both save lives and stop injuries on our roads. The 28,000 figure is false.
This is the figure for head injuries from ALL causes not from Cycling. The figure recorded from
cycling is 1,200. In order to save the other 26,800 perhaps all children should be made to wear
helmets at all times even in bed as falling out of bed can cause severe head injury.

The suggestion that 85% of these injuries could be prevented by wearing a cycle helmet is an absurd
fiction. Research by the TRL suggested a figure of 16% however there is also evidence from Australia
that wearing helmets increases the frequency of serious neck injuries.

There is no evidence that the compulsory wearing of helmets saves lives and reduces injuries.
Figures from Australia show that the compulsory wearing of helmets brought about a major reduction
in cycling particularly among teenagers. The claimed reduction in head injuries was less than the
reduction in the amount of cycling so there was no reduction in the "Danger" of cycling.

Promotion of cycle helmets based on exaggerating the risks of cycling has the effect of reducing the
amount of cycling. Compulsory use of helmets would reduce cycling even more. Not only is this
contrary to the government's National Cycle Strategy but the consequent reduction in healthy
exercise will increase the number of premature deaths from heart disease. Some time since the BMA
came out against compulsion for this reason.

In Holland hardly anyone wears cycling helmets yet they do not have a problem with cycling head
injuries despite the vast number of cyclists of all ages.

I am not against helmets all together. For stunt riding and racing they may be appropriate though
the protection they give is limited to low speed impacts with flat surfaces. I am totally against
compulsion in this area as the case for them is at best unproven while the damage to cycling of
compulsion has been demonstrated in Australia and elsewhere.

So finally, I would ask you to reject this Early Day Motion and to warn your friends of the
falsehoods and dangers in it.

Regards"
 
In news:[email protected], Richard Burton
<[email protected]> typed:
> Some misguided MPs are being led by the nose by BHIT, which is back to its old tricks of making
> ridiculous claims about the efficacy of helmets and the numbers of children who would be saved by
> wearing one. The MPs have signed an Early Day Motion (text below) which has been signed, at the
> latest count, by 54 of them, including Glenda Jackson, who I thought knew better.

To find out if your MP's signed it, go to the following page

http://edm.ais.co.uk/weblink/html/motion.html/ref=1783

(it took me a fair bit of teomaing to find it, so I thought I'd share that.)

A
 
Ambrose Nankivell must be edykated coz e writed:

> In news:[email protected], Richard Burton
> <[email protected]> typed:
>> Some misguided MPs are being led by the nose by BHIT, which is back to its old tricks of making
>> ridiculous claims about the efficacy of helmets and the numbers of children who would be saved by
>> wearing one. The MPs have signed an Early Day Motion (text below) which has been signed, at the
>> latest count, by 54 of them, including Glenda Jackson, who I thought knew better.
>
> To find out if your MP's signed it, go to the following page
>
> http://edm.ais.co.uk/weblink/html/motion.html/ref=1783
>
> (it took me a fair bit of teomaing to find it, so I thought I'd share that.)
>
> A
>
>
At the risk of getting flamed, I always recommend the use of helmets, but still think it should be
down to choice above the age of 16, I am all for compulsory helmet use for the under 16's.

--
Ian

http://www.catrike.co.uk
 
Ambrose Nankivell must be edykated coz e writed:

> In news:[email protected], Richard Burton
> <[email protected]> typed:
>> Some misguided MPs are being led by the nose by BHIT, which is back to its old tricks of making
>> ridiculous claims about the efficacy of helmets and the numbers of children who would be saved by
>> wearing one. The MPs have signed an Early Day Motion (text below) which has been signed, at the
>> latest count, by 54 of them, including Glenda Jackson, who I thought knew better.
>
> To find out if your MP's signed it, go to the following page
>
> http://edm.ais.co.uk/weblink/html/motion.html/ref=1783
>
> (it took me a fair bit of teomaing to find it, so I thought I'd share that.)
>
> A
>
>
OOO, just noticed the best bit, compulsory for bicyclists, not so for tricyclists, so a jaunt to
the cafe sans helmet would still be ok for me. So on the great British tradition of "I'm alright
Jack" ........

--
Ian

http://www.catrike.co.uk
 
"Richard Burton" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Some misguided MPs are being led by the nose by BHIT, which is back to its old tricks of making
> ridiculous claims about the efficacy of helmets and
the
> numbers of children who would be saved by wearing one. The MPs have
signed
> an Early Day Motion (text below) which has been signed, at the latest
count,
> by 54 of them, including Glenda Jackson, who I thought knew better.

<snip>

Has anyone stopped to think of what would actually happen if this became "Da Law" ?..... I can't
help thinking that it would probably be policed about as well as the "not riding on the pavement"
law and the "using lights at night" law. Remember, we are all cyclists so don't really matter,
therefore our precious police time shouldn't be wasted by reinforcing any law that *might* be
beneficial to cyclists... (no offence intended to law enforcement there, merely politicians and they
can *all* go fcuk 'emselves ;-). I reckon we should let 'em pass the law and be damned. It won't be
enforced anyway so if you've got a particular stance with regards to this you can carry on going
helmetless anyway.....(just means you'll be a criminal in the eyes of the law and join all those
others guilty of victimless crimes that the Govnt. seem intent on filling our jails with)... Just my
pointless 2 euro worth... Dave ;-)
 
mae <[email protected]> wedi ysgrifennu:

> OOO, just noticed the best bit, compulsory for bicyclists, not so for tricyclists, so a jaunt to
> the cafe sans helmet would still be ok for
> me. So on the great British tradition of "I'm alright Jack" ........

AFAIK, helmets are compulsory for two-wheeled motorcycles but not for three-wheelers, so this
proposal would be consistent with that. Not that there's any reason that it should be.

--
Rob

Wildly Out Of Date Excel VBA Programming Stuff from the Heart of Wales:
www.analytical-dynamics.co.uk/

Please keep conversations in the newsgroup so that all may contribute and benefit.
 
Originally posted by Richard Burton
...an Early Day Motion (text below)

"That this House notes that every year in the UK approximately 28,000 children under the age of 16
years receive a serious head injury"

The 28,000 figure is false.
This is the figure for head injuries from ALL causes not from Cycling. The figure recorded from
cycling is 1,200.

Do you have sources for either of those figures? There has been some discussion of this on Urban Cyclist UK and the same claim (that 28000 is a figure for all serious head injuries) but it wasn't attributed either. No one has managed to find a good source for the actual figure for total child cycling releated serious head injuries although since legislation would be likely to be restricted to on-road cycling it is only fair to compare with the stats for on-road injuries (which seem to have the added attraction of existing)

best wishes
james
 
mae <[email protected]> wedi ysgrifennu:

> I reckon we should let 'em pass the law and be damned. It won't be enforced anyway so if you've
> got a particular stance with regards to this you can carry on going helmetless anyway.....(just
> means you'll be a criminal in the eyes of the law and join all those others guilty of victimless
> crimes that the Govnt. seem intent on filling our jails with)...

All very well until some nutter in an SUV breaks both your legs and his/her insurers fail to pay up
because you weren't wearing compulsory safety equipment.

--
Rob

Wildly Out Of Date Excel VBA Programming Stuff from the Heart of Wales:
www.analytical-dynamics.co.uk/

Please keep conversations in the newsgroup so that all may contribute and benefit.
 
Dave wrote:

> "Richard Burton" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> > Some misguided MPs are being led by the nose by BHIT, which is back to its old tricks of making
> > ridiculous claims about the efficacy of helmets and
> the
> > numbers of children who would be saved by wearing one. The MPs have
> signed
> > an Early Day Motion (text below) which has been signed, at the latest
> count,
> > by 54 of them, including Glenda Jackson, who I thought knew better.
>
> <snip>
>
> Has anyone stopped to think of what would actually happen if this became "Da Law" ?..... I can't
> help thinking that it would probably be policed about as well as the "not riding on the pavement"
> law and the "using lights at night" law. Remember, we are all cyclists so don't really matter,
> therefore our precious police time shouldn't be wasted by reinforcing any law that *might* be
> beneficial to cyclists... (no offence intended to law enforcement there, merely politicians and
> they can *all* go fcuk 'emselves ;-). I reckon we should let 'em pass the law and be damned. It
> won't be enforced anyway.......

I beleive that to be a very naive view, and a dangerous one. It may not be enforced by the police or
similar bodies but it sure will by the insurance companies.

If you are involved in a collision and injured (or worse), you would certainly have any damages
severely cut, perhaps to nothing. Even if it was not your fault you will be seen as putting yourself
deliberately at risk from increased injury by flouting the helmet law.

As it is, motorists get away with near murder with derisory penalties.

If you were not wearing a helmet they could simply drive into you and claim you should have been
protecting yourself so deserve what you get. The bully will have won. Even if Mr Plod turns a blind
eye, I fear the courts would uphold this view if you were helmetless and this law were passed.

John B
 
Ian wrote:
>>>
>>
> At the risk of getting flamed, I always recommend the use of helmets, but still think it should be
> down to choice above the age of 16, I am all for compulsory helmet use for the under 16's.

Seems a very reasonable position to me.

pk
 
"PK" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
> Ian wrote:
> >>>
> >>
> > At the risk of getting flamed, I always recommend the use of helmets, but still think it should
> > be down to choice above the age of 16, I am all for compulsory helmet use for the under 16's.
>
> Seems a very reasonable position to me.

Not really, as there is no real need for it, and a good chance that the "28,000" "serious head
injuries" are not done on public roads. It strikes me as being a bit too much "something must be
done", rather than bothering looking into whether it makes much difference.

I note that the MPs want to vote to say that the house believes that helmets prevent 85% of injuries
and deaths.

So they must be a good thing eh? Who'd vote for turning kids into vegetables?
 
"PK" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...

> > At the risk of getting flamed, I always recommend the use of helmets, but still think it should
> > be down to choice above the age of 16, I am all for compulsory helmet use for the under 16's.
>
> Seems a very reasonable position to me.

Seems a dangerous extension of the nanny state to me. Something the H&S Nazis are continuously
trying to do.

What is wrong with parental choice & responsibility?

T
 
W K <[email protected]> wrote:

> Who'd vote for turning kids into vegetables?

Most Cub leaders after a pack night!

--
Marc. Please note the above address is a spam trap, use marcc to reply Printing for clubs of all
types http://www.jaceeprint.demon.co.uk Stickers, banners & clothing, for clubs,teams, magazines
and dealers.
 
marc wrote:

> W K <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > Who'd vote for turning kids into vegetables?
>
> Most Cub leaders after a pack night!

Last night my daughter came home from cubs saying she had to take four vegetables next week.

What's going on?

John B
 
"JohnB" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
>
>
> marc wrote:
>
> > W K <[email protected]> wrote:
> >
> > > Who'd vote for turning kids into vegetables?
> >
> > Most Cub leaders after a pack night!
>
> Last night my daughter came home from cubs saying she had to take four vegetables next week.
>
> What's going on?

Other kids may be agog. Almost like seeing a chunk of moon rock or a diplodocus poo.
 
On Thu, 6 Nov 2003, Richard Burton wrote:
> Some misguided MPs are being led by the nose by BHIT, which is back to its old tricks of making
> ridiculous claims about the efficacy of helmets and the numbers of children who would be saved by
> wearing one. The MPs have signed an Early Day Motion (text below) which has been signed, at the
> latest count, by 54 of them, including Glenda Jackson, who I thought knew better.
>
> Attached is a copy of a letter from a CTC member to his MP re the EDM on helmets which might be
> useful as a template if BCC members want to respond similarly. The general thought is that this
> EDM will fail due to lack of time, but might be being used as a marker for inclusion in a road
> safety bill expected next year.

As I understand it Early Day Motions can't really "fail" or succeed: they are merely a way for MPs
to register their political opinions and draw attention to issues that concern them. They don't get
any parliamentary time at all, unlike the more significant Private Members' Bills (which do usually
fail for lack of time), and it would take many more than the 50-odd signatures that this EDM has
gathered to push the government into proposing a new law. As it stands we know that about 1 MP in 13
would be minded before the debate to vote for compulsion---not a great threat.

It's perhaps not entirely a bad thing, wherever you stand on helmets, if 54 MPs are sufficiently
engaged with the matter to put their names to one side of the debate; they are certainly opening an
invitation for people to write to them on the issue.
 
"Henry Braun" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:p[email protected]...
>
> It's perhaps not entirely a bad thing, wherever you stand on helmets, if 54 MPs are sufficiently
> engaged with the matter to put their names to one side of the debate; they are certainly opening
> an invitation for people to write to them on the issue.

what does concern me is that 54 of the highest in the land are gullible enough to swallow absurd
lies put about by people like BHIT. They aren't engaged witht the matter of cyclists' safety, they
are engaged in the matter of portraying cycling as dangerous and not to be undertaken without
special safety equipment. The fact that so many of our elected leaders can be so easily misled by a
obsessive propaganda organisation should be of concern to all of us.
 
Tony W must be edykated coz e writed:

>
> "PK" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
>
>>> At the risk of getting flamed, I always recommend the use of helmets, but still think it should
>>> be down to choice above the age of 16, I am all for compulsory helmet use for the under 16's.
>>
>> Seems a very reasonable position to me.
>
> Seems a dangerous extension of the nanny state to me. Something the H&S Nazis are continuously
> trying to do.
>
> What is wrong with parental choice & responsibility?
>
> T
>
>
>
They aren't all responsible.
--
Ian

http://www.catrike.co.uk
 
JohnB <[email protected]> wrote:

> > > Who'd vote for turning kids into vegetables?
> >
> > Most Cub leaders after a pack night!
>
> Last night my daughter came home from cubs saying she had to take four vegetables next week.
>
> What's going on?

Errr This is one of those tests they throw at you during training sessions isn't it?

Four vegetables... what can we do with that?

Cooking for chefs badge?

Discussion on where the Veg came from Global challenge badge?

Printing with them , Creative badge?

Tasting raw or cooked, World Around Us Zone?

Blindfold guessing of veg, World Around Us Zone?

Discusssion on what veg to eat, what's in them etc..Health and Fitness Zone?

Discussion of price/food miles, Global Challenge badge?

Do I pass?


--
Marc. Please note the above address is a spam trap, use marcc to reply Printing for clubs of all
types http://www.jaceeprint.demon.co.uk Stickers, banners & clothing, for clubs,teams, magazines
and dealers.
 
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