civil unrest in australia...what gives?



Carrera

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I know some moslems who seem O.K. to me. There is one guy from Iraq and he took up cycling. I think he lived in the Kurdish area. Seems to me like a nice guy and he works hard too. Such people I would never suggest deporting and they don't bother me in any way.
What bothers me is the people who preach hate and division or they try to change the society they migrate to (encouraged by ultra-liberal extremists in this country).
I was once a foreigner myself and speak from experience. There were things abroad I didn't like but it seemed to me I should be the one to adapt not vice versa.
Mostlly I think the liberal elite are to blame.
It can be uncomfortable for immigrants too when they see all these headlines in the papers where extremists bring their culture into disrepute. I understand this quite well. There are decent English folks living in Spain who feel embarrassed by the drunken thugs who smash up bars, shouting in the streets e.t.c.
Germans are also let down by a certain minority of drunkards, singing "Yellow Submarine" in German on the ferry e.t.c. prior to some football match.
I've seen it all. It's only not funny if you happen to be Spanish or a responsible ex-pat.

fatboy61 said:
My daughter went to a high school that was proud of its fairness, equity etc etc. They had a no-harrassment policy, an anti-discrimination policy etc etc. There was an area set aside for Moslem kids if they wanted to pray (as there should be). In her first year there she made the mistake of mentioning in class that she was a practising christian. This resulted her being made fun of, harrassed, etc etc, with her teacher (yes a lefty) being one of the chief offenders. (BTW I am not a born-again and consider myself to be left-leaning)
Religious and cultural tolerance should be for everyone, not just those whose background is exotic and quaint enough to endear themselves to the trendies.
 

Billsworld

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darkboong said:
For the record that's pretty much what I've seen, heard and my views pretty much chime with your wife's.



That's because you aren't thinking straight. Liberals like people to have the right and the choice to be uptight ****tards if they so wish. For the record I am an anarchist, not a "leftie". I know for a fact that just about every faith and government that I have come across *hates* my ideals. :)
Did you like the way i threw my wife under the bus to make a point. :)
 

mitosis

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mocka58 said:
With all due respect you are totally wrong. I don't know how this has played in the press overseas but it's certainly not to do with mods and rockers. I assure you race has everything to do with it. When a car load of youths of 'middle eastern appearance' ask an innocent person putting their garbage out at night if they are an Aussie or not and bashing them senseless when they answer 'yes', then most would think it is a racial problem.

Perhaps from a distance the reality of the situation has not been apparent.

I have to agree. Many years ago I used to be one of the many "westies" who caught the train to Cronulla, surfed all day then caught the train home. There was never any trouble except for the localism in the surf.

The current wave of westies includes large numbers of people of arab descent who harass locals, using vile language to the "Australian" women while supervising fully covered Moslem women as they swim. They are looking for fights and regularly start them. They have no respect for authority.

Unfortunately authorities has allowed this to happen. Political correctness means that every time these groups are targetted to control them the bleeding hearts cry racism and unfortunately that triggers the politicians to act to not act (if you can understand what i mean).

There are many people of middle eastern descent who over the last 100 years have integrated into Australian society but due to the larger numbers in the last 20 years they form insular groups who behave as the like.

I'm not condoning the violence but the blame lies with governments that have not acted because of the fear of being blamed as racist.
 

mitosis

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Carrera said:
I'm afraid your response is typical of the usual Question Time BBC audience who tend to be so politically correct, they refuse to look facts in the face.
I'm not suggesting in any way that these far-right Australian gangs are justified beating up immigrants simply because they have a Middle Eastern appearance.
What I am suggesting is there is obviously a problem in Australia which revolves around lack of integration - same as in France. It doesn't apply to all immigrants, just some of them. It's the "some of them" that should be shown the door.
I don't see why my view that all immigrants should accept the values of a host country seems so radical to you and Boogers. Myself, I've lived in several foreign countries for prolonged periods and I would never have taken the view rules should be altered on my account, or people should be bending over backwards to accommodate me.
I simply minded by own business and accepted any cultural differences I came across.
Torching cars, burning schools, churches and synagogues is totally unacceptable behaviour.

Sorry mate but these are not far-right Aussie gangs. They are mainstream, usually law-abiding people who have had enough of people who make no attempt to integrate into society and who have no respect for the laws of Australia.
 

biker jk

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The problem is Islam and its backwardness. Muslims do not intergrate. Never have and never will. Australia make a huge mistake in allowing them to immigrate. The Lebanese muslims in Australia are the problem. They are separatists and despise Australian culture. They fired gunshots at a school where Christmas carols were being sung, they burned down a Church hall trying to burn the church itself. This is religious extremism at its worst. Back to the middle east I say.
 

Billsworld

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biker jk said:
The problem is Islam and its backwardness. Muslims do not intergrate. Never have and never will. Australia make a huge mistake in allowing them to immigrate. The Lebanese muslims in Australia are the problem. They are separatists and despise Australian culture. They fired gunshots at a school where Christmas carols were being sung, they burned down a Church hall trying to burn the church itself. This is religious extremism at its worst. Back to the middle east I say.
Sorry for not understanding all the details, but this violence sounds more like young punks....?? That type of behavior might not be exclusive to any one race of punks. I think it might be less about islam and more about gang violence. On the flip side of that immigration needs to be tightly controlled if the culture in the country is to be preserved. We have certain towns here in the US where the hispanic community is demanding that the public schools teach thier kids in Spanish. There has also been a movement in California to teach young black kids in ebonics. Teachers need to learn to teach in ghetto slang. :mad:
 

limerickman

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Carrera said:
Lim has expressed this view before. I sometimes wonder whether Lim is somehow isolated from the media and news as a whole. :confused:
Where are all these Jewish people who are antagonising people?
I wonder how Lim feels about the Catholic Churches that have been torched by Middle Eastern gangs in Australia. No Jews were involved. Then you have the Madrid train bombing. That was carried out by extremist moslems. Again no Jews involved. The 9/11 terrorists were all of Middle Eastern origin but not Jewish and the same goes for the London bombers.
The riots in France were carried out by extremist moslem gangs of African origin. No Jews were involved.
So, what is the answer? Firstly, the only reason there is resentment against Jews is due to religion since the two main world religions originate from Judaism. Secondly, all the ethnic tensions in Europe and now Asia are being caused by extreme Islam.
In some ways, it's amusing to see all these Europeans voice anti-semitic sentiment while the Jews quietly return to their homeland and leave countries such as France to their fate of blazing cars and ethnic riots.

This is going way off topic : but I feel compelled to respond.

For whatever reason - the Jewish people have been on the receiving end from
a whole range of nationalities and ethnic groups, throughout history.

History shows us this : Egypt, the Romans, Poland 17th century, the Cruscades, the Nazi's, to name but a few.

CR seems to take umbrage at my use of the terms antagonise.
Maybe I used the incorrect phrase, when I wrote antagonise but how else can one explain why one race of people have managed to incur the wrath of so many diffuse and varied entities through ancient and modern history ?

No one has alleged that there was any Jewish involvement in 9/11, Madrid or 7/7 : so carrera for you to say that the Jews weren't involved in these matters is irrelevant.

As regards the causes of 9/11, Madrid etc, I think these issues are not the result of clashes of civilisations or Muslim V Secular.

Despite your best attempts to suggest that they are.
 

limerickman

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mitosis said:
I have to agree. Many years ago I used to be one of the many "westies" who caught the train to Cronulla, surfed all day then caught the train home. There was never any trouble except for the localism in the surf.

The current wave of westies includes large numbers of people of arab descent who harass locals, using vile language to the "Australian" women while supervising fully covered Moslem women as they swim. They are looking for fights and regularly start them. They have no respect for authority.

Unfortunately authorities has allowed this to happen. Political correctness means that every time these groups are targetted to control them the bleeding hearts cry racism and unfortunately that triggers the politicians to act to not act (if you can understand what i mean).

There are many people of middle eastern descent who over the last 100 years have integrated into Australian society but due to the larger numbers in the last 20 years they form insular groups who behave as the like.

I'm not condoning the violence but the blame lies with governments that have not acted because of the fear of being blamed as racist.

Mit,

I hear what you're saying and I accept what you're saying here.

Can I get some calrification from you.
I understand that radio jock Alan Jones has been stoking up the fires of down there over this issue.
Is this correct ?
 

Colorado Ryder

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limerickman said:
CR seems to take umbrage at my use of the terms antagonise. Maybe I used the incorrect phrase, when I wrote antagonise but how else can one explain why one race of people have managed to incur the wrath of so many diffuse and varied entities through ancient and modern history ?
Perhaps they antagonize others when they are blamed for crucifying Christ? Or because they tend to stay together? Maybe the perception that they are good business people? Maybe they are just good scapegoats that have become stereotyped through history. Maybe because they are God's chosen people that others feel the need to persecute them. The Jews have always been used to blame others problems on.
 

limerickman

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Colorado Ryder said:
Perhaps they antagonize others when they are blamed for crucifying Christ? Or because they tend to stay together? Maybe the perception that they are good business people? Maybe they are just good scapegoats that have become stereotyped through history. Maybe because they are God's chosen people that others feel the need to persecute them. The Jews have always been used to blame others problems on.

I can't vouch for why so many disperate entities felt the need to blame the Jews.
I can only say that the Jews were on the receiving end throughout time.

Which begs the question as to why?
 

mitosis

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limerickman said:
Mit,

I hear what you're saying and I accept what you're saying here.

Can I get some calrification from you.
I understand that radio jock Alan Jones has been stoking up the fires of down there over this issue.
Is this correct ?

He sure has. Now that man is far right wing.

I don't listen to him on the radio but the reports are that he was encouraging the "locals" to use violence on his talk back radio show and cutting off views of moslems who rang up to distance themselves from the lawless mobs who have been harassing people.

There has even been talk of arresting him under new sedition laws.
 

scotty72

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mitosis said:
He sure has. Now that man is far right wing.

I don't listen to him on the radio but the reports are that he was encouraging the "locals" to use violence on his talk back radio show and cutting off views of moslems who rang up to distance themselves from the lawless mobs who have been harassing people.

There has even been talk of arresting him under new sedition laws.
What a load of ****!

Like you said, you didn't listen - instead you choose to repeat sensational media reports which are printed / broadcast for a political purpose.

I was listening, all he did was report the content of the text messages that were circulating.

Several times he encouraged people not to act on the

If he didn't, he'd be accused of censorship etc.

It is amazing how people choose to be ignorant of the facts, then shoot their mouths off.

Scotty
 

Carrera

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"the bleeding hearts cry racism and unfortunately that triggers the politicians to act to not act."

I always figured the average Australian has more backbone than the Brits (although people in Scotland and Wales tend to be less wishy-washy than the English).
English society is filled with these politically-correct do-gooders you always find in a crowd watching the King parade naked in his invisible suit. The intellectual bleeding hearts over here will be more than willing to point out what an authentic suit that is.
Then you get the fools such as me who openly suggest the King is genuinely in the all-together. :p
That's how it is over here and we're colectively worse off than you Aussies. The tales I could relate of large groups of immigrants claiming welfare under multiple names, claiming for children who remain in their native lands, setting up benefit fiddles as a business and getting free health care ahead of folks who worked all their lives.
I know a lot about this as I had a Ukranian friend who knocked about in refugee circles and he knew what was going on only too well. I heard of fraud being reported and the authorities don't act due to fears of being accused of racism.
I heard of ex WW2 veterans selling their medals to keep warm while the welfare system is being fleeced by fraudsters.
There are now hundreds of French immigrants who took part in the last riots standing in line on the French border to get to the U.K. where they know they'll get instant cash, free-housing and a sympathetic ear from some do-gooder in an office (telling them what a shame it is France drove them to the point they had to set torch cars in the streets).
I don't mind educated, decent immigrants from any country but these days they let anyone in and if you object you're apparently a racist neo Nazi.

mitosis said:
I have to agree. Many years ago I used to be one of the many "westies" who caught the train to Cronulla, surfed all day then caught the train home. There was never any trouble except for the localism in the surf.

The current wave of westies includes large numbers of people of arab descent who harass locals, using vile language to the "Australian" women while supervising fully covered Moslem women as they swim. They are looking for fights and regularly start them. They have no respect for authority.

Unfortunately authorities has allowed this to happen. Political correctness means that every time these groups are targetted to control them the bleeding hearts cry racism and unfortunately that triggers the politicians to act to not act (if you can understand what i mean).

There are many people of middle eastern descent who over the last 100 years have integrated into Australian society but due to the larger numbers in the last 20 years they form insular groups who behave as the like.

I'm not condoning the violence but the blame lies with governments that have not acted because of the fear of being blamed as racist.
 

Carrera

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Lim, there's a very simple answer to your question and if you think it through, you'll probably grasp this simple point.
The Jewish race is the only race to have a saviour of all humanity linked to Jewish ethnicity. Jesus was Jewish, Mary was Jewish, the apostles were Jewish.
This is why Jews have been persecuted to some extent.
But please don't forget so have the Christians who were thrown to wild dogs in Roman arenas or forced to offer sacrifice to the emperor.
But, at any rate, think about it. If the assumed saviour of the world had been Japanese, you'd have had ant-Japanese sentiment and jealousy by other religious people. The Jews are a non-gentile nation, linked to the one word religion that gave birth to most other religions.
You dislike Jews because of your Catholic beliefs and because you want Jews to accept catholic ideas concerning the messiah. Moslems also want Jews to hand them Jerusalem. It's all about religion and Jewish people are sometimes disliked due to their religion.



limerickman said:
This is going way off topic : but I feel compelled to respond.

For whatever reason - the Jewish people have been on the receiving end from
a whole range of nationalities and ethnic groups, throughout history.

History shows us this : Egypt, the Romans, Poland 17th century, the Cruscades, the Nazi's, to name but a few.

CR seems to take umbrage at my use of the terms antagonise.
Maybe I used the incorrect phrase, when I wrote antagonise but how else can one explain why one race of people have managed to incur the wrath of so many diffuse and varied entities through ancient and modern history ?

No one has alleged that there was any Jewish involvement in 9/11, Madrid or 7/7 : so carrera for you to say that the Jews weren't involved in these matters is irrelevant.

As regards the causes of 9/11, Madrid etc, I think these issues are not the result of clashes of civilisations or Muslim V Secular.

Despite your best attempts to suggest that they are.
 

Carrera

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I found this article that is probably already known to most people. The Catholic Church has always had religious issues with Jews and has been held responsible by many for fanning the flames of the hollocaust.
Just as is the case with moslems, it's all linked to religion:

"The 27,000-word article - which hit newsstands in the United States this week - accuses the Roman Catholic Church of providing the intellectual stimulus for Nazism and the Holocaust.
It is among the most savage attacks yet made on the record of alleged Catholic anti-Semitism.
But the author of this huge article is no stranger to controversy.
Some of the allegations have been made before, notably that the Pope during the war, Pius XII, didn't do enough to protect the Jews, even though he must have known what was happening to them. His argument, in a nutshell, is that traditional Church teaching - blaming Jews for the death of Christ - sowed the seeds of the genocidal anti-Semitism of the 20th Century."
 

davidmc

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Carrera said:
Lim, there's a very simple answer to your question and if you think it through, you'll probably grasp this simple point.
The Jewish race is the only race to have a saviour of all humanity linked to Jewish ethnicity. Jesus was Jewish, Mary was Jewish, the apostles were Jewish.
This is why Jews have been persecuted to some extent.
But please don't forget so have the Christians who were thrown to wild dogs in Roman arenas or forced to offer sacrifice to the emperor.
But, at any rate, think about it. If the assumed saviour of the world had been Japanese, you'd have had ant-Japanese sentiment and jealousy by other religious people. The Jews are a non-gentile nation, linked to the one word religion that gave birth to most other religions.
You dislike Jews because of your Catholic beliefs and because you want Jews to accept catholic ideas concerning the messiah. Moslems also want Jews to hand them Jerusalem. It's all about religion and Jewish people are sometimes disliked due to their religion.
This makes perfect sense. It goes along the lines of"Pick on the big-kid on the block", if you want to make a name for yourself. I suspect that there is some subconscious envy involved there as the rest of the worlds religions consist of "johnny-come-lately's" based upon judaism. Much like the American bashing that appears to be en vogue these days. Bashing the administration is fine by me but, the whole country; thats another matter.
 

davidmc

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Carrera said:
I found this article that is probably already known to most people. The Catholic Church has always had religious issues with Jews and has been held responsible by many for fanning the flames of the hollocaust.
Just as is the case with moslems, it's all linked to religion:

"The 27,000-word article - which hit newsstands in the United States this week - accuses the Roman Catholic Church of providing the intellectual stimulus for Nazism and the Holocaust.
It is among the most savage attacks yet made on the record of alleged Catholic anti-Semitism.
But the author of this huge article is no stranger to controversy.
Some of the allegations have been made before, notably that the Pope during the war, Pius XII, didn't do enough to protect the Jews, even though he must have known what was happening to them. His argument, in a nutshell, is that traditional Church teaching - blaming Jews for the death of Christ - sowed the seeds of the genocidal anti-Semitism of the 20th Century."
That would reinforce King Henry VIII's decision to seperate.
 

davidmc

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Carrera said:
I found this article that is probably already known to most people. The Catholic Church has always had religious issues with Jews and has been held responsible by many for fanning the flames of the hollocaust.
Just as is the case with moslems, it's all linked to religion:

"The 27,000-word article - which hit newsstands in the United States this week - accuses the Roman Catholic Church of providing the intellectual stimulus for Nazism and the Holocaust.
It is among the most savage attacks yet made on the record of alleged Catholic anti-Semitism.
But the author of this huge article is no stranger to controversy.
Some of the allegations have been made before, notably that the Pope during the war, Pius XII, didn't do enough to protect the Jews, even though he must have known what was happening to them. His argument, in a nutshell, is that traditional Church teaching - blaming Jews for the death of Christ - sowed the seeds of the genocidal anti-Semitism of the 20th Century."
That would further justify King Henry VIII's decision to seperate aside form the fact that he had buisiness to take care of that the RC church was impeding.
 

mitosis

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scotty72 said:
What a load of ****!

Like you said, you didn't listen - instead you choose to repeat sensational media reports which are printed / broadcast for a political purpose.

I was listening, all he did was report the content of the text messages that were circulating.

Several times he encouraged people not to act on the

If he didn't, he'd be accused of censorship etc.

It is amazing how people choose to be ignorant of the facts, then shoot their mouths off.

Scotty

Beg to differ big mouth. I read word for word what he said. I can understand you coming to a different conclusion if you have a barrow to push, but you can't change what the man said.

They (the newspapers) are still talking about it today. Maybe you're little out of step or, like I said, have preset views. ;)