Just did my first TT today

[maydog]

+1 on aerobars. If you are going to be doing TTs on a regular basis - aerobars offer a lot of bang for the buck. The advantage of going aero is second only to riding in a paceline. I like using them on long solo rides, not just races, they make a century with 6 hours of headwind much more tolerable.

I am not sure if the 2300's are different than the my old Sora's with thumb shifters; I can do a decent time trial with clip-on aerobars on that bike. I don't even have to get out of the aero position to shift, just a quick action with the right hand and I am set. Aero with clip ons, the thumb shifter is just as easy to shift as is the lever.

Shifting from the drops is a tiny bit more effort than using the levers, but not enough to complain.

I would take a second look at your front derailleur adjustment before ditching it - how much do you trust your mechanic? Perhaps its just an issue with the stops, or you could adjust it to rub when on the lowest gear, largest cog instead of the highest gear - though don't overdo it or you could drop the chain. I ended up improving some shifting issues by ever so slightly rotating the front derailleur.

 

[alfeng]

Originally Posted by Dave Pace .

well the main reason for changing out is the shift/break leavers. When I was in the drops I could not change to a higher gear when i could use it with out getting out of the drops due to the way that the 2300's are designed. It has a thumb switch to go up a gear and is only able to be reached comfortably when you have your hands on top of the hoods.





I was looking at going with the 6700 ultra-gear group set due to it is all on the lever and that would be easier when in the drops and on the hood. Plus it would give me that 1 extra gear. Not only that but when i am in my highest gear on the rear. the chain always rubs on the Front Derailleur. I have had the bike shop check it out and they see it happening, but if they change the front derailleur it would not shift correctly should I ever want to use the small chain ring on the crank for some hill.

I agree that being fit takes priority. I may not look like the best in shape guy out there with my weight, but i can keep up with them when it comes down to ti and I will be trying some of the races with my club. i may not win but it is really the only way I can better myself and have fun doing it IMO.

is it possible to do just the rear derailleur, cog and shifter with the ultra gear if I wanted to and leave the front alone or is that a no no?

Based on what you said, you MAY be a candidate for different shfiters ...

BUT, really, you probably just need to unwrap your handlebars & move the shifters to a new location on the forward curve of your handlebars ...

• I don't know for sure, but I would actually guess that there is 99% probability that the shifters were designed to be used from the Drops .... it's just that over the past 12+ years, in particular, that the average rider has finally realized that the "aerodynamic" brake levers work as well from the Hoods as from the Drops (vs. the older brake levers whose brake cable came out from the top of the lever) ...
• THAT can be evidenced by looking at older catalogs or issues of cycling magazines and seeing how Shimano (in particular) levers were set up with the horns much lower on the forward curve of the handlebar ...

As one of the people who uses Campagnolo levers, I think that I would have to work really hard to position them on my handlebars in a manner which would make them unusable from the Drops, but I'm sure it could done if someone hit me on the head and left me indifferent ...
Now, as far as the chain rubbing on the front derailleur cage, if your Crankset is a Double (vs. a Triple) then because your 2300 shifters are probably Triple-capable (that's right, SRAM users need-not-apply if they are having shifting problems ... but, they can apparently buy a new RED front derailleur which has "yaw" to overcome the limitations of the SRAM front shift mechanism in their Road levers -- the reason why the limitation was not anticipated is obvious to me, BTW ... but, that's another 'story'!), one option would be to put an OLDER (e.g., 8-speed) front derailleur on your bike ...

• the plates of the cage on an 8-speed Shimano front derailleur are further apart than on either a 9-speed or 10-speed or 11-speed Shimano front derailleur

• FYI. It may NOT be considered to be ideal, but any Triple-capable Shimano Road shifter can be used to shift an otherwise inappropriate front derailleur across a Double Chainring crankset ...
• it then becomes less important to match the chain to the front derailleur
• if you wanted to, then, you could even use a 10-speed Shimano chain (but, why?!?) with an 8-speed Shimano front derailleur OR almost any vintage cable actuated front derailleur ...

Several years ago, to test THAT notion, I successfully mated a pair of 9-speed Shimano 105 Shifters with an 8-speed XT (top pull) front derailleur. One of the "extra" indents moved the derailleur & 9-speed chain the "extra" distance between the two Chainrings.

• yes, that means that a large number of the Cyclocross riders can probably ditch the pulley wheel used to redirect a top mount cable with their Road front derailleur if they choose the RIGHT shifters (again, not SRAM!)

FWIW. While testing the compatibility limitations of a Campagnolo front shifter, I mated one with a vintage 6-speed (c1980) Dura Ace front derailleur ...

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It works fine, IMO. It just requires an extra indexing "click" to move the Chain all the way from the inner to the outer Chainring.

The bottom line is that you should be able to resolve your shifter & chain problems for significantly less than the cost of a new Ultegra shifter ...

And, FYI, you can "fix" your existing front derailleur for less than $1.00 ...

• if the rear of the front derailleur cage is held together with a screw, then you simply need to insert a ~1mm-or-2mm thick spacer/washer + a longer bolt (available from Home Depot)
• if the rear of the front derailleur cage is riveted, then you need to drill out the rivet insert a ~1mm-to-2mm thick spacer/washer & bolt together

Adjust the the derailleur, if-and-as necessary.

 

[Dave Pace]

Awesome reply, I will look in to that home depot method, But I am going to look for a new shifter for the rear, I'm thinking going to the 105 shifter or the 6700 shifter. I like the looks of them, and they also have the shift options like I want.

As far as the aero bars, Ill get me a cheap pair of those as I will not be using them that much, maybe once a month as that seems to be how often we do the TT.

 

[Dave Pace]

And on a side note, I just found out I have been riding my bike with under inflated tires. By like 40 lbs under inflated. (Shakes Head) I only found out because I was tired at guessing the pressure in my bike tires and got a good tire pump from the local Bike shop while I was riding home from work, I then took my bike inside, hooked the new pump up and saw that the tire that was suppose to be at 110 was only at 50 or 60 lbs. So considering that the temp was 70 outside, and I just rode 7 miles home from work, the tire had to have higher pressure due to it was warm. now I wonder if I could have done a lot better in that TT if I had the right tire pressure.

 

[danfoz]

Originally Posted by Dave Pace .

I was tired at guessing the pressure in my bike tires and got a good tire pump from the local Bike shop while I was riding home from work, I then took my bike inside, hooked the new pump up and saw that the tire that was suppose to be at 110 was only at 50 or 60 lbs. So considering that the temp was 70 outside, and I just rode 7 miles home from work, the tire had to have higher pressure due to it was warm. now I wonder if I could have done a lot better in that TT if I had the right tire pressure.

Congratulations on making one of the best bike investments aside from an actual bike, riding shorts, and shoes. You probably could have gone a little quicker but what firm tires are great at is making the bike more responsive to rider input. Now since you got a pump with a gage if you really wanted to cut a few mors secs off would be some latex inner tubes. Question is are you willing to put up with the very minor hassle over butyl tubes - pump 'em up everyday, and install with slightly more care making sure no bits of inner tube are peeking out between rim and tire. The speed benefit there is very real and one of our respected forum members recently posted some sobering numbers to confirm. If I remember correctly they're good for at least an additional 1mph all else being equal (approx 15-25 watts savings). You may also experience fewer flats. Certainly worth the price imo.

 

[Dave Pace]

Originally Posted by danfoz .


Congratulations on making one of the best bike investments aside from an actual bike, riding shorts, and shoes. You probably could have gone a little quicker but what firm tires are great at is making the bike more responsive to rider input. Now since you got a pump with a gage if you really wanted to cut a few mors secs off would be some latex inner tubes. Question is are you willing to put up with the very minor hassle over butyl tubes - pump 'em up everyday, and install with slightly more care making sure no bits of inner tube are peeking out between rim and tire. The speed benefit there is very real and one of our respected forum members recently posted some sobering numbers to confirm. If I remember correctly they're good for at least an additional 1mph all else being equal (approx 15-25 watts savings). You may also experience fewer flats. Certainly worth the price imo.

Funny you bring that up. Some club members and I were talking about exactly that. I do want to switch over, but I bought me a nice little stock pile of butyl tubs, so what I was going to do is wait till my new conti 4000 get here. in a day or 2, then try to punish my current stock tires as much as possible, then switch over to the coti4000 with latex tubes.

 

[danfoz]

Originally Posted by Dave Pace .

Funny you bring that up. Some club members and I were talking about exactly that. I do want to switch over, but I bought me a nice little stock pile of butyl tubs, so what I was going to do is wait till my new conti 4000 get here. in a day or 2, then try to punish my current stock tires as much as possible, then switch over to the coti4000 with latex tubes.

Nice. Though latex can be patched, I also usually carry a butyl spare aside from my patch kit. Gives me a little more margin for sloppy install on the side of the road if I do run out of patches or get a cut too big to be patched. Truth is, since installing latex innies and running with them exclusively since last September I have yet to flat. Have gone through a set of Vitt CX's, CG's and put some good wear on a set of 4-Seasons. YMMV. Just a note, I have installed a fresh set of innies with each tire change, the latex tubes seem to get a bit sloppy after being used, like a ballon that doesn't quite spring back to its original shape after being inflated. They like to stick to the tire once installed, so much so they almost need to be peeled off when changing tires, so I make sure they are nicely powdered up before installing. And they remember every cranny inside the rim/tire. Once you've taken your first pair off you'll know what I'm talking about.

 

[Dave Pace]

So just an update to this from 1 year ago. I did my TT for this year, I improved by 1mph avrage this year, and I placed in the cannibal placing. I did get what could be called Aero bars this year. the were S-works Aerofly. I love them and they are great

 

[AyeYo]

I just registered for my first TT today. Any noob to noob advice you can give me?

 

[danfoz]

Originally Posted by Dave Pace
So just an update to this from 1 year ago. I did my TT for this year, I improved by 1mph avrage this year, and I placed in the cannibal placing. I did get what could be called Aero bars this year. the were S-works Aerofly. I love them and they are great

Good job!

 

[danfoz]

Originally Posted by AyeYo
I just registered for my first TT today. Any noob to noob advice you can give me?

Dave may also have some wisdom to depart but I would add, regardless of distance, make sure you don't go out too hard. That is the part we all got wrong as noobs, and still sometimes do.

 

[swampy1970]

Originally Posted by danfoz regardless of distance, make sure you don't go out too hard

That is the biggest thing to watch out for.

Practice your starts and pacing for the first 3 minutes a few times in each ride before your TT. Just as an example, if you're hoping to average 20 mph, start off in 52x19 or something similar. You just want a reasonable gear that you can roll over for about 10 seconds and not have to struggle to get the revs up so you can sit down and pedal. The key there is 'pedal' - you don't want to mash a gear out of the start. You'll have enough adrenaline in you too ensure that you don't start too slow and even if you do go a bit too slow it's no biggie - you can make up a bit later on. Better to leave 10 seconds on the line in the first mile than to try and gain 10 seconds and loose 2 minutes in the last half of the race. Aim to be about race pace at around a minute and at race pace at 2 - note, race pace isn't race effort. Roll off the start line with purpose and don't sprint. Sit down and wind up the gear. Due to aerodynamics, your speed will rise quickly when you're going slower and if you keep the effort the same you'll ultimately reach your 'cruising speed' aka race pace.

If you were well trained and had a power meter, you could get to race effort sooner but when left to "best guess" much much better to err on the side of caution.

The other big mistake for TT's, especially ones shorter than 30 minutes, is lack of warm up. You need a really good warm up. Unless it's a hot day, 20 to 30 minutes, starting ease and throwing in some 1 to 3 minute efforts above your TT pace. Not only will it get your mind and body ready for the effort, it'll also help calm the nerves somewhat too. Nothing like a good "f**k me this is hard" effort in warmup to quell the butterflies in your stomach.

I'd also lay off food within the final hour before the start and drinks, apart from the odd sip here and there, within the last 30 minutes.

When you get to the event, sign in and get your number as soon as possible. Before your warm up ride from your car to the start and see how long it takes - note any traffic lights or junctions that may affect the time it takes to get there. That time plus a few minutes is the absolute latest you need to leave the car in order to get to the start. Ideally, you just want to roll up to the start with a few minutes too spare.

Read the event organizers notes, especially about rules of the road and stuff like performing U turns in the road near the start and finish. If it doesn't say anything, ask at sign in if they're OK and if so you can get to the start earlier and ride up and down the road for a bit. If it says "no u turns" then there's probably a reason for it and often that reason is chats with local Police and Sherriff departments or notifications from USA Cycling... A best you might get a shouting at for doing a U turn near the start - at worst you may be spotted by the local Police who may recommend that the event isn't going to be allow to run next year...

Other than all that. If you don't have an aero helmet, even a cheap Giro or Bell aero hat off eBay is worth it's weight in gold. Aero bars - I dig the Profile T2 and T3 for their massive range of adjustability and the fact you can put the arm rests behind the bar. Don't wear a baggy top and make sure your number isn't a windsock when it's fastened on. If you're riding a road bike, take the bottle cage off the downtube and put it on the seat tube and leave the bottle in. Aero test seem to show there's some advantage there.

Train hard, rest well and get a really good nights sleep the night before. Good luck.

 

[Charlie M]

I am attempting my first TT in the road bike division on Saturday. I haven't done a lot of threshold work so my goal is just to push hard, find a groove that feels right, but remain patient and hope I judge the effort correctly. All these tips are super helpful. Thanks!

 

[AyeYo]

Originally Posted by swampy1970
Other than all that. If you don't have an aero helmet, even a cheap Giro or Bell aero hat off eBay is worth it's weight in gold. Aero bars - I dig the Profile T2 and T3 for their massive range of adjustability and the fact you can put the arm rests behind the bar. Don't wear a baggy top and make sure your number isn't a windsock when it's fastened on. If you're riding a road bike, take the bottle cage off the downtube and put it on the seat tube and leave the bottle in. Aero test seem to show there's some advantage there.

Train hard, rest well and get a really good nights sleep the night before. Good luck.

Thanks for all the good advice!!

I actually need a helmet that doesn't suck anyway. Is there an aero helmet that isn't a million dollars and can be used for everyday riding without looking like a pretentious asshole or dying of heat stroke in the summer? I'm having a hard time finding one. The non-tear drop shape helmets seem to all have these wannabe Top Gun visors. Are those removable? The Giro Air Attack looks good, but come on... $200 for foam and plastic? Why? Just because they can?

 

[maydog]

I have seen several claims that a bottle on the downtube is more aero than a seat tube. For a Short TT, no frame bottles and an aerobar torpedo mount is supposed to be the best - until you want to take a drink.

 

[swampy1970]

Originally Posted by AyeYo


Thanks for all the good advice!!

I actually need a helmet that doesn't suck anyway. Is there an aero helmet that isn't a million dollars and can be used for everyday riding without looking like a pretentious asshole or dying of heat stroke in the summer? I'm having a hard time finding one. The non-tear drop shape helmets seem to all have these wannabe Top Gun visors. Are those removable? The Giro Air Attack looks good, but come on... $200 for foam and plastic? Why? Just because they can?

They can because it works.

Anything at the front of the bike/rider combo is where the airflow is tripped the most. Heads are big, therefore helmets are important...

But for $200 you get more of an advantage than a $3000 set of wheels. Look at it that way and it's cheap. And at ~$1000 per hour testing prototypes, aero development ain't cheap.

As auto (car) racers say - speed costs, how fast do you want to go?

You could pick up a Giro Selector for just over $100. Combine that with a Profile T2 or T3 bar for another $100 - that's a very significant time savings for cheap if you set them up right. A gain for $200 that I'm not sure you're get any other way at that cost/time saving.

 

[swampy1970]

Originally Posted by Charlie M
I am attempting my first TT in the road bike division on Saturday. I haven't done a lot of threshold work so my goal is just to push hard, find a groove that feels right, but remain patient and hope I judge the effort correctly. All these tips are super helpful. Thanks!

Of all that I typed (and what Dan said), start sensibly. Go too hard at the start and you risk trashing the rest of the ride...

 

[AyeYo]

Originally Posted by swampy1970

They can because it works.

Anything at the front of the bike/rider combo is where the airflow is tripped the most. Heads are big, therefore helmets are important...

But for $200 you get more of an advantage than a $3000 set of wheels. Look at it that way and it's cheap. And at ~$1000 per hour testing prototypes, aero development ain't cheap.

As auto (car) racers say - speed costs, how fast do you want to go?

You could pick up a Giro Selector for just over $100. Combine that with a Profile T2 or T3 bar for another $100 - that's a very significant time savings for cheap if you set them up right. A gain for $200 that I'm not sure you're get any other way at that cost/time saving.

I guess that makes sense. I ended up with a Louis Garneau Chrono-Leggera, because for $140 shipped it's reasonably priced and well ventilated enough that I can wear it on my normal group rides without looking like a total idiot or having my ears blocked. It's probably not quite as aero as something that's over the ears and has a full tail, but it'll certainly be better than a standard helmet. It has an optional windscreen too if I really want to look the part.

I checked out the Profile bars. I like the position of the T2 better. That'll be my next order.

The race I'm doing is only an 18k, so I'm thinking no bottles at all.

 

[danfoz]

Originally Posted by AyeYo

The race I'm doing is only an 18k, so I'm thinking no bottles at all.

It's a short distance but If no bottles make sure you are fully hydrated, and drink plenty the day before. If you haven't gotten up in the middle of the night at least once to pee you didn't drink enough. I got that from Lance Armstrong who may know a think or two about riding a bike fast. You'll also then want to drink after the warmup.

Depending on the inclines and the wind, 18k takes me about 27-30 minutes. When I do my SST efforts indoors (20 minute intervals), as I am watching both my power output and my HR, I can see a dip in my HR of a few beats with each of the sips of water I take toward the end of my effort. HR gradually increases over that length of effort if you keep the power steady (in my own SST workouts my HR will climb from about 75%maxHR to 85%maxHR give or take). You'll need to decide if the few seconds you save from ditching the waterbottle is worth a few bpm. 30 minutes riding on a cool day will be different than riding balls out for ~30mins after a 20 minute warmup.

Only you know your body, but personally I would take a bottle for anything lasting over 15 minutes. The key factor in riding that bike as fast as you can is to know your physical limits, be comfortable and confident in your riding position, and eliminate any potential snafu's.

Btw if you have not done much riding at TT speed, breathing is also critical. Focus on the exhale, the inhale will take care of itself. In addition to drinking, when my HR starts to climb more than I'd like during my SST workouts, I can see the bpms drop/stabilize when I really start to focus on my breathing.... deep controlled breaths filling the stomach first and then the chest, big strong exhales. For that distance I would make sure to not drop the hammer too heavily for the first 3-4 minutes, better to finish strong wishing you could have gone a bit harder than to spend the last 5 minutes dying. The latter will actually have you more likely finish a couple mins slower overall.

It's 18k, I definitely wouldn't skimp on the warmup, even if its a warm day. For me that would be at least 20 minutes slowly bringing up the HR to about 80-85% of max, with one or two 2 minute efforts at slightly over the pace of what I planned to do the ride at just to flush out the pipes, and finally leaving about 10 minutes to stabilize before actually rolling out the start gate.

 

[AyeYo]

27-30 minutes is solid effort. I looked up last year's times and I only need to average like >20.5mph to not be dead last, which is my goal haha. I know I'm capable of doing that (barring any massive hills) even without the extra aero equipment. I actually enjoy riding at higher speeds whenever possible and perfer it to long and slow rides, which is why I figured this would be a good form of racing to try out (the lack of pack riding/crashing is nice too). I have a 23 mile section of bike trail that I ride a couple times per week on summer evenings and I like to keep it at 20-22mph (granted it's very flat and there's rest breaks for traffic crossings), so I figure 11 miles shouldn't be too bad. I guess my concern about the water wasn't so much the aero gain of not having a bottle (which will be like, what, 1.5 seconds?) but the time wasted drinking from it. I think you're right though, being thirsty on a hot day will probably cost far more time and I'm only there for fun; I have zero chance of setting a respectable time.

Everything I've read about TT racing has mentioned the importance of a good warmup, so I guess I'll plan on getting there very early and bringing the KKRM. If you're doing short, high effort stuff though, aren't you worried about burned up anerobic stores you might need later? Is a relaxed or tempo spin for 20-30 minutes really not sufficient? Does anyone take creatine the morning of races? I know caffine is a good suppliment and carbs are important.

I'll give the breathing practice a try. I think I'm pretty good at it from my fast rides, but now that I have a HRM I can better monitor. There's a park near my house that has a nice crit course that I plan on using for practice because I don't have to worry about road crossings/interruptions.